Horus and Creature Swap

E

exodia

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Is it a legal combo having your own Horus and activating creature swap them getting nothing and you a free monster.

Here is what people at my local tournament are saying:

Randal the Galaxy Judge has spoken to other official Judges and they have come to the agreement that Creature Swap and Horus Lv6 combo could not work. The reasoning is that if ether monster's control does not switch to the other player Creature Swaps effect cannot be resolved and thus canceled. Randal made this call because he thought it was the most logical way to go about this. We as players must respect Randals decision and play Horus according to this call.
Despite any argument or conclusion there is not any pacific rulings regarding the Horus and Creature Swap combo. Therefore no matter what can be said it will still remain arguminative until Upperdeck releases such rulings. Tell that time we cannot be for sure
 
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This is precisley true. You cannot even activate creature swap if the only monster wither play could choose has the effect of Horus LV4 OR LV6, since one says that its control cannot be switched and the other cannot be affected by magic in this way. If when Creature swap resolves, there isn't a legal target for both players to choose, then its effect fails and vanishes.
 
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Manta said:
This is precisley true. You cannot even activate creature swap if the only monster wither play could choose has the effect of Horus LV4 OR LV6, since one says that its control cannot be switched and the other cannot be affected by magic in this way. If when Creature swap resolves, there isn't a legal target for both players to choose, then its effect fails and vanishes.
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You are wrong.

Here is the link to a discussion on this topic. Until recently, everyone was under the Impression you could not activate a Spell Cards effect on Horus LV6.

Horus LV6 is just unaffected by Spell Cards. Nowhere in its card text does it state that "This monster cannot be chosen as a target for Spell Cards, and cannot be selected for effects of Spell Cards."

http://www.yugiohrealms.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=419065

I would have posted the exact comment, but Realms is blocked for me at work.

Incidently, I was at that tournament.
 
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masterwoo0 said:
You are wrong.

Here is the link to a discussion on this topic. Until recently, everyone was under the Impression you could not activate a Spell Cards effect on Horus LV6.

Horus LV6 is just unaffected by Spell Cards. Nowhere in its card text does it state that "This monster cannot be chosen as a target for Spell Cards, and cannot be selected for effects of Spell Cards."

http://www.yugiohrealms.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=419065

I would have posted the exact comment, but Realms is blocked for me at work.

Incidently, I was at that tournament.
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Actually, Manta is perfectly correct. From the Judge's List:

Since Horus lvl 6 is uneffected by spell cards, if you have Horus lvl 6 and
one other monster on the field, and your opponent activates Creature Swap,
could you choose Horus lvl 6 and in turn have Creature Swap not fully resolve?




Answer:

If "Horus the Black Flame Dragon LV6" is face-up you cannot select it with
the effect of "Creature Swap." This is because Horus LV6 is not affected
by Spell Cards.

If "Horus the Black Flame Dragon LV6" is face-down, there is no issue.

----------------------------------
Curtis Schultz
Official UDE Netrepâ„¢
CurtisSchultz_netrep@hotmail.com
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http://lists.upperdeck.com/read/messages?id=3521#3521

So here's your 3rd opinion. What you are trying to do is illegal. The judges were right. You cannot use Horus lv6 (or lv 4...check rulings for Blindly Loyal Goblin in this case) with Creature Swap.
 
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novastar said:
Jdos, that post is outdated, it was recently changed, Steve posted the new rulings about half a week ago on Realms.

Check the new Non-Spellcasting Area ruling for more info.

You can activate Creature Swap even if the monsters on the field are Unaffected, they even can be chosen and the effect of Creature Swap will simply be negated.

This is how it should have worked from the start.
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All well and good. But any way you slice it, you're not going to activate Creature Swap and pick your Horus lv6 to get a free monster...which was the meat of the original question.

[rant not directed at you]
My question is, why are ruling updates being given on Realms and not on the list? Seems like a bassackwards way to do things and yet another thing that pi**es me off about UDE. I mean, if you're going to have your representitives posting in an official context on various forums, dontcha' think it would be a good idea to consolidate that info somewhere. I dunno, maybe a central location, like a Judge's List?!? Novel Idea.

Maybe bishop could get us a bot to monitor Realms, ETC., & Pojo too, since Steve and Kevin seem to like to post there more than the list.

I'm really beginning to think that this game is wasting more of my time/money than it is giving me back in entertainment value.
[/rant]

Well...I feel better now. :D
 
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jdos said:
All well and good. But any way you slice it, you're not going to activate Creature Swap and pick your Horus lv6 to get a free monster...which was the meat of the original question.
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And that's what I told them at the Tourney. You cant resolve Creature Swaps effect since Horus LV6 cant switch control.

From what I came to understand, a player had used Creature Swap, "selected" his Horus LV6, took his opponents monster, then said that since Horus LV6 is unaffected by Spell Cards, he got to keep control of him, causing his opponent to lose his monster.

What started the whole discussion was I told them that Horus LV6 was simply "unaffected" by Spells, but you could still "activate" Creature Swap, with the effect disappearing, and no monster switching control.

The argument afterwards was, there had to be at least one eligible monster, along with Horus LV6 on the same side in order to activate Creature Swap, from which I told them that Horus LV6 is only unaffected by Spells, and could still be selected, but the effect would not resolve.

It went round and round, but since I wasnt Judging, I left it to Randall.
 
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masterwoo0 said:
And that's what I told them at the Tourney. You cant resolve Creature Swaps effect since Horus LV6 cant switch control.

From what I came to understand, a player had used Creature Swap, "selected" his Horus LV6, took his opponents monster, then said that since Horus LV6 is unaffected by Spell Cards, he got to keep control of him, causing his opponent to lose his monster.

What started the whole discussion was I told them that Horus LV6 was simply "unaffected" by Spells, but you could still "activate" Creature Swap, with the effect disappearing, and no monster switching control.

The argument afterwards was, there had to be at least one eligible monster, along with Horus LV6 on the same side in order to activate Creature Swap, from which I told them that Horus LV6 is only unaffected by Spells, and could still be selected, but the effect would not resolve.

It went round and round, but since I wasnt Judging, I left it to Randall.
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Understood. The "You are wrong." reply to Manta made it sound like you were agreeing that you could indeed get a free monster by choosing Horus lv6 for Creature Swap. So the answer is right, but the reasoning behind it has been changed. No problem there.
 
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