So, HOW do you think is the best way of using Treeborn Frog in metagame lvl wise?

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drzero7

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This reminds me when Pot of Avarice hit the USA metagames. Everybody knew it's potential, but at first, either people used it and got bombed, or people just put it in side-decks and didn't know what to do with it.

NOW we know how to manage Pot of Avarice so now we're seeing 1x like in every deck. But before, this card was hectic.

And now we got another extremely good potential card legal in metagames but people also have no real clue to use it's max potential.

The best way of using Treeborn Frog is tribute monsters. But which tribute monster is the best for this? And if you decide to pump alot of tribute monsters, and never draw Treeborn Frog, your nuked big time. And the rise of Kycoo these days will get even more popular to counter this card. So how will people use this frog to it's full potential is something even I can't predict. I certainly didn't use Pot of Avarice at ALL at first cause I thought putting 5x monsters fast was impossible. And the last thing I need is a dead card at my first draw. I had enough cases where I drew nothing but s/t for my first 6 cards in my hand which makes me wanna kill something.

However, there are some talks of the good use for this.

#1: To use it well, you need no s/t on your field on your stand-by phase. And I said, during stand-by. You can set s/t all you want as LONG as they're very chainable happy. Of course, this excludes from popular traps like Saku, Widespread, Torrential, etc. And this might bring back something that is extremely trigger happy like Enemy Controller, along with some other "forgotten" cards like "Time Seal", "Compulsory Evacuation Device", etc. (Think of this possibility. I tribute summon my Mobius, bust 2 s/t and attack. Set CED. My foe uses Smashing Ground, I chain CED to put Mobius back to my hand. USUALLY, this is BAD, but if I have Treeborn Frog in my graveyard, this is NO PROB at all. Re-tribute Mobius for another s/t bomb! Heck, you can do this with Zaborg too.)

#2: Treeborn Frog is pretty "useless" card at your hand. For one thing, you have to set it, meaning your wasting your valuable summoning for just a 100DEF monster. A good "use" to make it worth doing this is something like "Share the Pain", Creature Swap, Enemy Controller, etc. Heck, this is another good way to use Treeborn Frog. Keep summoning it from your graveyard and keep swapping it. (It'll be a semi-Goat Control people oh-so-hated.) Heck! It's 1 star meaning we can use it for Meta i.e. TER! And you can time this anytime once Treeborn Frog is in the graveyard. (Too bad Meta is limited 1 per deck, or else we can Meta-TER the frog, and then use another Meta for another TER, and, you know where I'm going with this. The only way to get three TER in todays format with the frog is Treeborn Frog + Meta + Tsukuyomi + MoF. But that's a 4 card combo not to mention 3 of them are restricted 1 per deck... NOT happening.) Or with the popular Merchants running around, you can HOPE that your Merchant automatically trash your Frog in the grave.

#3: The best use is tribute monsters. (Or somekinda semi-Goat Control, I already gave examples.) So can you pack 5-8x Tribute monsters? (Heck, maybe even Dark Dust Spirit might be okay with this.) Well you might, but then having the frog in your grave is a must. And then you need to search that thing and thus you should pack stuff like Mother Grizzly. I don't know. We might see the new "Grizzly Control" with something like 2x Mother Grizzly, 2x Treeborn Frog, 1x Yomi Ship. (Tomato Control with a twist) And then throw in like 1x trap like Spiritual Water Art - Aoi. (Throw in 3x Mobius, and then you got 8 water monsters to use this trap on.) With hand count going crazy high and game tempo slow and fat as butter, more hand discards are good. And unlike Donny/Spirit Reaper, you can LOOK before you discard so almost no chance of you getting bombed by Goldd unless 1x Goldd was the ONLY CARD in the foe's hand or something.

I don't know, I'm just saying a bunch of thing. I test played this frog casually and still can't figure out the best potential equasion that is Treeborn Frog. Heck, I didn't figure out Pot of Avarice use until I cheated looking at the Metagames top 8 list a bunch of different tournaments.

What are your thought and your current use of this toad?
 
Let me name a few things which I think will be big ways to abuse Treeborn Frog:

1. Tributing. As drzero7 stated eariler, this card is best used with the Monarchs because it is cost-less. Essentially, you get free tributes. This is almost equivalent to tributing Sangan for a monarch. BUT, besides the monarchs, there's Jinzo, Blowback Dragon, Horus LV 6, Kaiser Glider etc.

7* and 8* monsters have no problem now, since, EC, Brain Control and Soul Exchange can enable their summoning. Popular monsters include DMoc and SPoN. If you want to stay true to the Water theme, you could let TF revive itself, play ALO and tribute TF for Levia Dragon Daedalus, and then declaring priority to use its effect.

2. Metamorphosis. TF is a lvl 1 self recurring monster. This makes Meta less of a dead draw and essentially a 1 for 1 card in terms of sp. summoning a lvl 1 fusion, i.e. TER. If TER's effect resolves, Meta becomes a +1 and potentially more if equipped TER can successfully destroy a monster by battle.

3. Advantage. Play defensively and let the opponent try to swarm (or outswarm) you. Their over extension will cost them when you play Dark Hole/Torrential. Creature Swap is also another good way to gain advantage.

4. Protection. A common misconception about running chainable cards over non chainables is that most of them do not provide inherent advantage. Bottomless, Saku, Widespread, and Trap Hole have not suddenly become worse. You're still going to need those cards to protect yourself. Wouldn't you rather have those traps getting rid of opposing threats than a self continuous recurring mini wall that does nothing else?

When TF is in the grave, your trap will get rid of the threat during the opponent's turn. Come your turn, you have no backfield and TF will sp. summon itself to be ready for one of its uses outlined above.

Downsides.

1. Vunerability. Sometimes, you have to leave yourself open in order to revive TF. That means no bluff set cards. You run the risk of getting killed in one turn (Bazoo/Return) or suffering from heavy damage just to ensure TF's revivial for a morph or a tribute. Furthermore, no backfield means you are prone to hand disruption and graveyard removal (Don/Reaper and Kycoo).

2. Dead cards. The only time my set Saku became useless AND I badly needed to tribute a TF was when TF was in the grave, and the opponent had Mirage Dragon/Pitch Black Warwolf/Jinzo on the field. The 1600s are not too troublesome in most cases, but if draw after draw are dead cards (such as monarchs), you will be closer to death as each turn passes by. In addition, because TF enables free tribute summons, opposing Jinzos can wreak serious havoc on your plans.

3. Kycoo will come back. It is inevitable. In some places, it already has, in order to combat Pot of Avarice. Now, there is more reason to main/side this spellcaster. 1800 is still good and its effect will shut down TF/tribute reliant decks.

I predict TF, SPoN, DMoC, Monarchs, Metamorphosis and Kycoo to be abused widely in the upcoming two SJCs because of the reasons outlined above.
 
The tribute monsters that are best for Treeborn Frog would be those tribute monsters that are good but are tribute monsters. :p Aside from Mobius the Frost Monarch and other popular Monarchs, you'd probably try something like Dark Ruler Ha Des, Ancient Gear Beast, Airknight Parshath, and other useful yet unused 1-tribute monsters.

#1: My philosophy on this is:

If you have a Sakuretsu Armor face-down. Treeborn Frog is only needed if you have a tribute monster. If you're not using your Sakuretsu Armor, your opponent isn't attacking you, therefor you don't need a high level monster, unless it's Mobius the Frost Monarch. If you're running 2-3 Treeborn Frogs (2, please, don't run 3) you absolutely MUST have an abnormal trap lineup. Having an abnormal trap lineup, you'll have tribute monsters like Mobius the Frost Monarch to pick up the slack of your lack of s/t destruction. (A lot of cases, no Dust Tornado are run) All of the traps must be used almost immediately after set. This includes cards like Drop Off, Time Seal and all that jazz. So Bottomless Trap Hole and Dust Tornado would be out of the question in a Treeborn Frog heavy deck.

#2: Treeborn Frog is not a bad draw, if you know how to use him. If you have monsters you'd rather be summoning, you don't need to use Treeborn Frogs effect. I tend to let him rest in my hand and hope for the best when the Don Zaloog/Spirit Reaper me. A lot of times, my opponent takes him out. When they attack a Treeborn Frog out of my hand, I gain advantage. They did something that doesn't help them at all. But helps me. (Same is said with Thunder Dragon, but Thunder Dragon doesn't have the useful effect in the grave) Merchant also helps for putting it in the graveyard. Treeborn Frogs best uses aside from tribute fodder. Is Enemy Controllers and other 1-monster-cost cards. Enemy Controller would probably be the best choice though, since you can play it from your hand during your Standby phase, sack Treeborn, take their monster, and your Treeborn Frog comes back the same Standby phase. :)

#3: I've seen a new water deck, Grizzly Control is already quite popular. It uses Abyss Soldiers and Water Arts. Sack those Treeborns for free and take stuff out of their hand. It works quite well, but trust me, come this Saturday/Sunday, you'll see some Treeborn Frog abuse on Metagame. :) If we don't. I guesed wrong.

Like I just said. Expect Treeborn Abuse to be at a high this weekend. I'm running Treeborn Abuse next weekend at Long Beach. :)

It's definately "up there."
 
Oh yeah, TER is also 1 per deck. Forgot.

But yeah, I'm also expecting TER coming out of the "sidedeck" randomness cause with Treeborn Frog, your almost always garenteed to have 1 potential lvl 1 free Meta-able monster for TERing. Now even with just 1 Meta doesn't seem so bad if you pack yourself like 2x Grizzly + 2x Treeborn Frogs. (Again, I'm expecting some "Grizzly control" with the format of 2x Grizzly + 2x Frog + 1 Yomi Ship for decks that depend on froggy control)

Yeah, I'm expecting Saku, Bottomless and Torrential to stay. But I think regular Trap Hole and Widespread will be ditched for the frog temporary. Especially since the rumors of Mirror Force coming back. (I SAID rumors) IF Mirror Force comes back, it's 1x Mirror Force + 3x Saku is 4 monster killing protection traps. That's good enough for a deck that's gunna use Treeborn Frog.

Of course, we still have no clue of the April Ban list.

Yeah, Kycoo will be the new D.D. Survivor "must-tech" monster in main decks IMO. I mean, with stuff like Pot of Avarice, Deko, Merchant and now Treeborn Frogs... something have to stop these flip-flop hand controls.

I know I put Kycoo in my side-deck for my serious Cookie-Cutter deck now. (I didn't before)

I don't know, Helpoemer is kinda predictable. If you tribute summon and then SET the tribute monster... that kinda rings the bell that it's a Helpoemer or something similar with nasty effect that your foe will almost never attack it without using MSlv2 or NoCed or something.

Heh, I love Ancient Gear Beast. I have that in my Machine deck. It stomps all over the DD families, Newdoria, Sangan, all searchers, and not Saku/Widespread to worry about. The only annoying monster that's bad against Ancient Gear Beast is Cyber Dragons and DEF Spirit Reaper. (Yeah, stupid Cyber Dragon, another reason why Airknight Parshath dropped in popularity.) Because if that, instead of AG Beast, we'll see Ha Des instead. (Even Chainsaw Insect can't kill this thing)

And I'm currently side-decking 1x Chainsaw Insect. I mean, GEAF and other of those, "I switch myself to DEF after I attack" is one thing, cause at max, those are 2300ATK monsters, but Chainsaw Insect is something else. It's an INSTANT 2400ATK, meaning it'll kill Monarchs. (Something those goblins can't do) I'm trying to see how good Chainsaw Insect will go against Soul Control. Sure my foe draws a card, but it might be the only way to get rid of those high ATK monsters once your top decking with few or 0 cards in your hand.

Actually, Dust Tornado isn't that much of a prob with Treeborn Frog. Just make sure your foe have a s/t on the foe's field, and you can chain Dust Tornado during draw or stand-by phase to free up s/t space for Treeborn Frog. But BTH, Torrential, Saku, Widespread are definately not friendly with Treeborn Frog.

And I forgot about Abyss Soldier. Yeah, he can ditch that Frog anyday. But ah, I miss those days where Abyss Soldier was used to ditch Sinister Serpent. lol. (Of course, that evil snake can do MUCH better then just Abyss Soldier)
 
TsunamiArmy said:
i really only plan on using Treeborn Froggy in water decks, as either tribute fodder or a returning defencive wall.

had an idea though for another use for it, but i don't know if it will work......Treeborn Frog + Horn of Heaven = bye bye anything your oppoent cares to summon ???
Click to expand...

At least some people are finding inventive ways to use it.
 
tiso, treeborn is perfect for any card that makes me discard one monster from my field, since i know most times froggy will just come back....works well with spiritual art - aoi.

i also tried using it as a discard cost for Divine Wrath, but i found i was better off using tadpoles instead (to get them in the gy for Des Frog) and just have treeborn on the field as trib fodder for Des Frog.

trying to rework my whole frog deck to minimise the use of "staples" and other cc-ish cards.....with the exception of mobius and treeborn
 
So if Treeborn Forg was a different attribute, you'd use it in that attribute type deck only?

The reason why it was abused and countered so much was because of the anticipation of its heavy use. If you stuck with Water and only Water, you are limiting yourself with Mobius, and Levia Dragon Daedalus as the good tributes. If you used Horn of Heaven, you're open to special summons the opponent may do after you neagetd their first summon. If you used Spiritual Art - Aoi, you're also open to attacks.

BUT, if you combine TF with other cards such as Metamorphosis, Creature Swap, other Monarchs, and other tributes, you are bound to be more successful on the competitive level. This is the key to deckbuilding: incorporating good options and techniques into a deck and executing them as needed during the course of the game.

SJC Long Beach will solidify all this.
 
Err.. just because Treeborn Frog is Water doesn't mean it should only belong in a water deck... I mean, everyone uses Reaper and are they all running Zombie deck? No.

I'll say Treeborn Frog is splashable. And alot of my predictions came true. Like people bringing back Meta for turning frog into TER, and along with Enemy Controller. (However, what I forgotten about Enemy Contoller is that people mainly used it AGAINST the foe's Treeborn Frog, turning that frog into ATK position after the declared their attack, and thus if the foe didn't chained Saku, they missed their timing.)

What I WAS wrong was that nobody bothered using Mother Grizzly to speed up the draw of this card. I mean, they totally depended on luck for Frog Draw except for maybe Sangan...
 
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