TT vs Bottomless

S

Skylerr

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Player A: summons Tribe infecting virus
Player B: Chains with bottomless Trap hole
Player A: Responds with Torrential Tribute

What happens?
 
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Bottomless Trap Hole has not successfully resolved, so we know not if it will do so successfully. Anyway, Torrential Tribute has activation timing for a summon, as does BTH. Both are Spell Speed 2, and as such can be chained to each other, granted the LAST SUCCESSFUL event was a summon, TIV in this case. It has nothing to do with skipping chain links.

-chaosruler
 
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ChaosEmperor12 said:
that cant be

it cant skip a step in the chain
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Yes it can:

If the timing for one is correct than the timing for all is correct.

An entire chain is ALWAYS responding to the same event whether it has 2 chain links or 12 chain links.

you can see examples here:
http://www.cogonline.net/threads.5615 (post #4)

and here:
http://www.cogonline.net/threads.8981

and on the Judge's list:
http://lists.upperdeck.com/read/messages?id=2931

Keeping in mind for the last one that Archfiend of Gilfer also follows response timing "the last thing to resolve"
 
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ChaosEmperor12 said:
im gonna use an unrelated example

If you activate "Ring of Destruction", and intend to chain "Barrel Behind the Door" to it, if your opponent chains something in-between (even an unrelated effect like "Jar of Greed"), then you cannot chain "Barrel Behind the Door" because "Ring of Destruction" is no longer the preceding step in the chain.
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Barrel Behind the Door does NOT follow response timing. It does NOT respond to anything that has resolved.

Edit: Counter Traps (other thant Negate Attack, Horn of Heaven, and sometimes Solemn Judgment), and spell speed 2 cards that specifically negate or modify other card effects in a chain have a different timing, they must be chained to the card they are negating or modifying.

(e.g. Serial Spell, Pot Robber, Sorceror of Dark Magic, Horus the Black Flame Dragon LV 8)
 
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it couldn't even be activated

I first said that Bottomless Trap Hole could be activated because of priority. Actually, the turn player has priority, and could activate Torential Tribute. But if Bottomless Trap Hole were activated first, I also realized that Torrential Tribute could also still be activated because the last thing to successfully occur in the game would have been the summon of a monster. This post has been edited, incase anyone quoted what I had said before. I am new to the forum, so I apoligize for anything that I have done incorrectly.
 
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I agree totally. Also, I would just like to mention that in this case, Player B would not be able to activate BTH until Player A either uses Pority or passes it to player B, so Player A may use Tribe's effect, before BTH is chained to the sucessful summon of Tribe.
 
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roadhouse007 said:
Torrential Tribute' Could not be activated, and here is why:

Player summons "Tribe Infecting Virus"
Opponent can activate "Bottomless Trap Hole" when priority shifts to him
Player cannot chain to "Bottomless Trap Hole" because it is not chaining to the summon, which is required for "Torrential Tribute". "Torrential Tribute" is not considered activated and goes face down, and "Bottomless Trap Hole" removes "Tribe Infecting Virus" from play.
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One thing to remember here: This USED to be true (on more than just the activation issue too). A lot of changes have occurred in the last year that have completely turned this game on its ear. And there seems to be no end in sight of the changes that will continue to send judges and players into convulsions over what only seems to be the right direction of gameplay.

However, with the whole "last thing to resolve" issue, there is now the ability for multiple effects to respond to a Summon since it was the last thing to happen. It doesn't always make sense, but once one figures out some of the little nuances in the mechanics, it sure makes understanding rulings a lot easier. Sometimes. ;)
 
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And there is something that I think should be pointed out. Even though it continually gets corrected in this forum it seems to be continually stated. You can never, ever, ever chain to a summon. You can only respond to it. I know that it's probably what people mean to say and simply type it incorrectly. But it's most definitely an illegal action.

Suggesting that you are chaining to the summon suggests that the summon hasn't resolved yet and is the last step in the chain. If that were true then Bottomless Trap Hole and Torrential Tribute couldn't be chained becasue no summon has succesfully occured yet. And we know this isn't the case.
 
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ChaosEmperor12 said:
incorrect.... the TIV would be remoced from play the chance to respond to the summon is gone the player would actually be responding to Bottomless Trap Hole with Torrential Tribute which is not correct for the activating conditions
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Remember, you resolve these steps in reverse order.

Since the last thing to resolve into play was Normal Summon, it goes like this:

ChainLink1: Bottomless Trap Hole
ChainLink2: Torrential Tribute
Resolve Steps in reverse order
Step2: Torrential Tribute
Step1: Bottomless Trap Hole

bishop said:
However, with the whole "last thing to resolve" issue, there is now the ability for multiple effects to respond to a Summon since it was the last thing to happen. It doesn't always make sense, but once one figures out some of the little nuances in the mechanics, it sure makes understanding rulings a lot easier. Sometimes. ;)
Click to expand...

Can't argue with that.
 
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