Whoa, I'm creating a topic (Q. about summoning control)

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Raijinili

New Member
Can someone refer me to the rulings where they say:
A) A summoning by your card to your opponent's field can be treated as a summon controlled by you for the purposes of cards such as Bottomless Trap Hole.

B) A summoning by your card to your opponent's field can be treated as a summon controlled by your opponent for the purposes of cards such as Bottomless Trap Hole.

Because I was thinking about it and I just realized that one of those were wrong (sorry, no spoilers) and I wanted to make sure that they were actually supported by rulings, and not just made up by someone posting in this topic, before I questioned the ruling on the judge list.
 
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The timing for BTH is after the successful summon. By that time the object is now controlled and operated by the opponent.

The text on BTH could actually mean:

"When a monster controlled by the opponent is [all_summon_types]"

In that case the ruling is correct, even if it was your effect that summoned it.
 
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Your statement would then contradict the fact that if I summon the monster, my opponent can BTH it since the only condition on the card is when my opponent summons a monster. If you're going by not being able to activate it based on who's controlling it, then you are contradicting what is stated on the card.

Essentially, it shouldn't work both ways. Either go by the summoner (the way it's printed now), the controller (if you want to errata the card which I don't see happening), or remove the ruling altogether (which is what's causing this well, rule violation, in the first place).
 
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My personal feeling is that the Lava Golem ruling is incorrect.

The only way for it to be correct is if the text is slightly off.

Just as in activation, the player who initiates it, should be the one performing it. All triggers and activation requirements should be based off of that player.
 
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But technically, your opponent is doing the summoning when your Cyber Jar resolves, as they have drawn from thier Deck, selected thier 1500- ATK monsters and decide thier positon. Lava Golem is very distictly being summoned by you to your opponents side of the field.
 
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Digital Jedi said:
But technically, your opponent is doing the summoning when your Cyber Jar resolves, as they have drawn from thier Deck, selected thier 1500- ATK monsters and decide thier positon. Lava Golem is very distictly being summoned by you to your opponents side of the field.
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So... what was this?

Digital Jedi said:
And might I point out that in spite of the ruling Skidster quoted, it has not yet been explained why you can Bottomless Trap Hole both the Lava Golem summoned by your opponent and the Lava Golem summoned by you.
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Raijinili said:
Remember that Summons are special.
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Yes true, and looking at both the Lava Golem and Cyber Jar ruling, i'm starting think that my original theory might be on the right track.

What hasn't been explained is which player is responsible for performing a summon in certain situations, and what the requirements for effect like BTH work in relation to the summon.

The Cyber Jar ruling seems to suggest that it is the player who controls the monster after the summon is successful.
 
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Digital Jedi said:
I said it has not been explained. If its not been explained then how can there be a ruling?
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I personally don't think that you can use it both ways.

I haven't seen anything that suggests that you could BTH a Lava Golem Special Summoned to your field by the opponent. It might just be implied by the card text, but it would be odd to think that you could do it both ways.
 
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