Cost vs effect

M

mikoal

Sinister Control
Can someone tell me how u can determine if something is a cost and if something is an effect?

I mean Lightning Vortex, Devine wrath, TIV, abyss soldier, raigeki break etc...... are all costs...


and i know costs, u have to discard the card first then the effect takes place

such as the creator, that is by effect.....
because the discarding part comes after the creators' effect....

once some thought that to determine costs vs effect, is reading where it says discard, as u can see most of the cost cards i've named mentions discarding in the first line.

But cards like serial spell isnt an effect and the discarding is mentioned mid paragraph. And i think for rope of life too? (if im not mistaken)

anyways, cost vs effect? is there a sure way of knowing just by reading? or do we all have to know them in our back of our heads kinda deal?
 
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yea i mentioned that creator=effect
anmd serial and rope = costs .....

already....

so basically to determine if one is cost, we must look at activation requirements?

but it seems like sreial's requirement is only to normal spell cards
 
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To determine cost vs effect, we must ask Konami. Normally, a cost will either be at the very beginning of the text or right after the activation requirement. I believe there are exceptions, though...

-pssvr
 
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This are the cards that have the cost of discarding.
A Feather of the Phoenix
Abyss Soldier
Archlord Zerato
Back to Square One
Cost Down
Curse of Aging
Cursed Seal of the Forbidden Spell
Cybernetic Magician
D.D.M. - Different Dimension Master
Dark Core
Dark Paladin
Darkness Approaches
Divine Wrath
Double Attack
Double Spell
Elemental Hero Thunder Giant
Final Destiny
Forced Ceasefire
Gray Wing
Hallowed Life Barrier
Infernal Incinerator
Jowgen the Spiritualist
Judgment of Anubis
King of the Swamp
Kuriboh
Lady Ninja Yae
Light of Judgment
Lightning Vortex
Magic Jammer
Malice Dispersion
Monster Reincarnation
Non Aggression Area
Phoenix Wing Wind Blast
Raigeki Break
Reshef the Dark Being
Return of the Doomed
Rising Energy
Rope of Life
Serial Spell
Special Hurricane
Spell Purification
Spell Vanishing
Spirit Ryu
Spiritual Energy Settle Machine
The Dragon's Bead
Thunder Dragon
Tribe-Infecting Virus
Tribute to The Doomed
Type Zero Magic Crusher
Vampire Genesis
VW-Tiger Catapult
XY-Dragon Cannon
XYZ-Dragon Cannon
XZ-Tank Cannon
YZ-Tank Dragon

Any other cards like The Creator have as a part of their effect, to "send to the graveyard" a card, or to "discard" only after the effects resolves.
 
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WHat you have to do is realize that, 99% of the templating for a cost is consistant. But notice The Creator's text:

Select 1 monster from your Graveyard. Send 1 card from your hand to the Graveyard and Special Summon the selected monster.

This is not the typical templating for costs. Cost are almost always listed in the first sentance and seperate from the effect. "Select 1 monster from your Graveyard and send 1 card from your hand to the Graveyard." would have been more accurate.

Also notice the sentance the second sentance: "Send 1 card from your hand to the Graveyard and Special Summon the selected monster." Rarely will a cost be lumped into the same sentence as the effect. As I said they are almost always seperate.

The templating for cost is fairly consistant, it just helps if you know what to look for.
 
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That is just coincidental. There were costs well before the Dark World monsters set was made up.

A cost is the requirement to activate certain effects.

Somebody mentioned that the cost for Serial Spell wasn't at the beginning of the text:
You can only activate this card when you activate one of your Normal Spell Cards. Discard all the cards in your hand to the Graveyard. The effect of this card becomes the same as the Normal Spell Card.

What I have started doing is reading the text from last to first.

The effect: this cards effect becomes the same as the Normal card
The cost: Discard all cards from your hand
The conditional requirement: can only be activated when you activate a Normal Spell card.

The Creator
Select 1 monster from your Graveyard. Send 1 card from your hand to the Graveyard and Special Summon the selected monster. You can only use this effect once per turn. This card cannot be Special Summoned from the Graveyard.

extra restriction: Cannot be Special Summoned from the Grave; can only be used once per turn.
Effect:Send one card to the Grave to special Summon the selected monster.
requirement: select one monster in your Graveyard.

Rope of Life
When 1 of your monsters is sent to the Graveyard as a result of battle, discard your entire hand to activate this card. Special Summon the monster to the field, increasing the ATK of the monster by 800 points.

restriction: none
effect: special summon the monster to the field; increase the ATK of the monster by 800
cost:discarding your hand
conditional requirement: when 1 of your monsters is sent to the Grave as a result of battle.

Sure, some cards will have extra requirements or restrictions tacked onto them, but basically the format stays the same. The effect, and what I have to do to get the effect.
 
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CraniumX said:
Well, the /simple/ reason that The Creator won't work with the Dark World monsters is that it's a "Send" and not a "Discard" effect. But yeah, we'll not open that one up anymore. Gotta love wording.
Click to expand...


yea, but no one mentioned that it would work with dark world monsters
 
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mikoal said:
yea, but no one mentioned that it would work with dark world monsters
Click to expand...

True, but there are some discussions about such things around here the last time: discarting/sending vs. Dark World, sending vs. swapping etc...
Just to make it more clear
 
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squid said:
A cost is the requirement to activate certain effects.

Somebody mentioned that the cost for Serial Spell wasn't at the beginning of the text:
You can only activate this card when you activate one of your Normal Spell Cards. Discard all the cards in your hand to the Graveyard. The effect of this card becomes the same as the Normal Spell Card.

What I have started doing is reading the text from last to first.

The effect: this cards effect becomes the same as the Normal card
The cost: Discard all cards from your hand
The conditional requirement: can only be activated when you activate a Normal Spell card.

The Creator
Select 1 monster from your Graveyard. Send 1 card from your hand to the Graveyard and Special Summon the selected monster. You can only use this effect once per turn. This card cannot be Special Summoned from the Graveyard.

extra restriction: Cannot be Special Summoned from the Grave; can only be used once per turn.
Effect:Send one card to the Grave to special Summon the selected monster.
requirement: select one monster in your Graveyard.

Rope of Life
When 1 of your monsters is sent to the Graveyard as a result of battle, discard your entire hand to activate this card. Special Summon the monster to the field, increasing the ATK of the monster by 800 points.

restriction: none
effect: special summon the monster to the field; increase the ATK of the monster by 800
cost:discarding your hand
conditional requirement: when 1 of your monsters is sent to the Grave as a result of battle.

Sure, some cards will have extra requirements or restrictions tacked onto them, but basically the format stays the same. The effect, and what I have to do to get the effect.
Click to expand...
I'll try to make this as concise as possible, as this is a HUGE topic.

Card game text is often built in a programming fashion, so people who understand computer programming will have an easy time understanding the concepts.

The overall template structure of Yu-Gi-Oh! card text is split into 2 main groups; Monster Card text, and Spell/Trap Card text.

The main reason for the split is because Monster Card's themselves do not have Activation Requirements (only their effects do), and that is generally replaced by Summon Requirements (or conditions if you like) or Card Characteristics or Conditions.

Monster Card Text

If we create a global template for the layout of a Monster Card's text it would look something like this... and would appear on the card in the order presented.

<Main Card Text 1>
- {Card Characteristics}
- {Card Conditions/Restrictions}

*Summon Requirements
- {Conditions/Abilities}
- {Cost}

<Effect 1>
*Activation Requirements
- {Timing/Trigger}
- {Targeting}
- {Cost}
- {Effect}
- {Effect Conditions/Restrictions}

<Effect 2>
*Activation Requirements
- {Timing/Trigger}
- {Targeting}
- {Cost}
- {Effect}
- {Effect Conditons/Restrictions}

As you can see there is a seperation between the <Main> global card text (which usually affects the monster card itself), and the <Effect> text. Each effect has all of the text pertaining to it encapsulated in a certain pattern.

While not all effects contain all the of the above features, i am just aiming to build a global feature set and outline of Monster Card Text.

Spell and Trap Card Text

In the case of Spell/Trap Cards it gets a little trickier due to the multiple types you can have. Non-Continuous cards have a slightly different template (feature set) than Continuous Cards, as they tend to combine <Main Card> and <Effect> text together. Continuous Cards tend to be more along the lines of Monster Card's and often have seperate <Main Card> and <Effect> text.

In general though, with Spell/Trap Cards the <Main Text> is slightly different.

<Main Card Text 1>
- {Card Characteristics)

*Activation Requirements
- {Card or Effect Conditions/Restrictions}
- {Timing/Trigger}
- {Targeting}
- {Activation Cost}

General Text Layout

The overall layout (for both types) looks like this:

<Main Card/Effect Text 1>

<Effect 1>
<Effect 2>

Addtionally, in the case of BOTH Monster Card and Spell/Trap Card text, you can have {Card Restrictions/Conditions} printed at the very end of the text, as if completely encapsulating the <Effect> text.

For example:

<Effect 3>
<Effect 4>

<Main Card/Effect Text 2>
- {Card Conditions/Restrictions}


Do understand that this is still a vague and loose structure. YGO text is not consistant enough to make a "one size fits all" templating scheme. Cards or effects do not contain all of the features outlined, it all depends on the card/effect itself. The order also does vary, but for the most part i've tried to look for the most prevalent pattern.

I would take a while to write a proper detained article on this, but hopefully this can guilde you into the right direction. Ask if you want more specific examples and i'll provide them.

*since i wrote this at work, and didn't research it 100%, the order of some of the categories may be off...i'll update later if i have too.
 
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Tell me something nova, has no one ever suggested or requested a netrep article from you? Or do you just not have the time? I know that it's not official but even you general knowledge of templating would make a very useful article.
 
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