cyber shadow guardna

[cuzwbd]

some questions.....
how does csg interact with royal decree...?if rd is "chained to" the activation, it should negate it and it would remain face up in s/t zone right?
but what if it is used in battle phase....is it still negated in the monster zone? does it stay there as long as royal decree is face up? can it still be attacked as a monster? and what would it's stats be? 0/0? or is it a meaningless trap in the wrong place?
if you only have csg and your opponent has multiple monsters, it seems like it gets new stats for every monster that attacks it, but its not clear.... also what happens if you activate a card like rush recklessly...if it adjusts stats for each attack - would it also keep the +700 for each attack?

 

[densetsu_x]

Just look at the rulings for Embodiment of Apophis for everything you need to know about Cyber Shadow Gardna and Royal Decree / Jinzo

"¢ vs. "Jinzo": If "Emodiment of Apophis" is a monster, and "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" is played, "Embodiment of Apophis" cannot remain as a monster and is placed face-up in the Spell & Trap Card Zone, where it remains on the field meaninglessly (even if "Jinzo" leaves play later). If "Royal Decree" is chained to the activation of "Embodiment of Apophis", the effect of "Embodiment of Apophis" is negated and it remains on the field in the Spell & Trap Card Zone meaninglessly.

 

[Digital Jedi]

if you only have csg and your opponent has multiple monsters, it seems like it gets new stats for every monster that attacks it, but its not clear.... also what happens if you activate a card like rush recklessly...if it adjusts stats for each attack - would it also keep the +700 for each attack?

It's ATK and DEF "become" the ATK and DEF of the attacking monster. So it is a new stat for every individual attack. So Archfiend Soldier attacks it, then Cyber Shadow Gardna gets 1900 ATK and 1500 DEF.

At this point, the ATK and DEF of your monster or his can be altered. For instance, if there is an active Gaia Power on the field, Cyber Shadow will gain that 500 boost in addition to the 1900 it just acquired.

If it somehow survives this attack, the next monster that attacks it will grant it its new ATK and DEF. So if Archfiend Soldier didn't manage to destroy it, then Lava Golem attacks it, it's new stats will be 3000/2500. And just as before, at this point, any outside modifiers, like Gaia Power, will now apply.

So you could conceivably activate Rush Recklessly after your monster was designated as an attack target, and it would gain the boost. But do it after its attacked, and not before, because if you do it before, Cyber Shadow will ignore the boost and "become" the stats of the attacking monster.

 

[SirViper]

ok i wont make another thread so ill post here since its about the same card... im clear on the atk/def values that csg will have but im wondering about its retreat ability... if jinzo/royal decree are out while csg is out... will the monster retreat in trap form at end phase? and if the monster is defeated in battle... does the trap go away as well or does the monster return to trap for later use... if in case csg cant return to trap while jinzo/royal decree are out... will it return if jinzo/royal decree leave the field... lemme know plz.

one more thing about the atk value... lets say i have gaia power out... lets say he has a 1500 atker... it'll become 2000... in main phase i activate csg which will become 2000 as the current atk value of the monster and get another 500 atk boost from gaia power becomming 2500 atk... is this statement true?

 

[skey23]

If "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" are played after "Cyber Shadow Gardna" has been activated, then the effect is negated and the card reverts back to only the Spell/Trap zone as a Continuous Trap Card. See rulings for "Embodiment of Apophis".

When you activate "Cyber Shadow Gardna" it will have an ATK of 500. Then, when it is selected as the attack target, it's ATK and DEF will become the same as the attacking monster. Then, after all that, any Field Spell modifiers will be applied again.


Hope this helps!

 

[SirViper]

well u didnt actually answer my questions...

1. if i activate csg in main phase, then royal decree/jinzo come in play... its effect gets negated... but in the same turn, in end phase what will happen if:

a. jinzo/royal decree is present in end phase, will csg flip back down in fd trap mode or stay fu meaninglessly, like a coth after bringing back a monster that is later tributed?

b. jinzo/royal decree aren't present in the end phase of either this or next turn... will csg be able to flip back down as a trap or is it a timing issue where it cant be flipped back down cuz its lost the timing by either having the effect negated or not being able to flip back down in the same turn it was flipped up due to jinzo/royal decree's presence.

2. if csg dies in battle, in end phase does it flip back down in trap mode or will the trap go to gy.

3. about the attack increase... if opp atks with a monster and then changes the attack values of either monster with something like shrink, limiter, rush recklessly... will csg automatically revert its stats to the newly modified stats? ie. if opps monster gains 700 atk with rush recklessly... with csg modify to gain that 700 as well? and if opp uses shrink on csg, will it modify back to the opps stats?

 

[skey23]

well u didnt actually answer my questions...

Fine...how's this.....

if jinzo/royal decree are out while csg is out... will the monster retreat in trap form at end phase?

No, because as soon as either "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" hit the field, "Cyber Shadow Gardna" will immediately go back to the Spell/Trap Zone, face-up, and simply go back to being just a Continuous Trap Card. (Answered in the "Embodiment of Apophis" rulings.)

and if the monster is defeated in battle... does the trap go away as well or does the monster return to trap for later use...

I'm going to assume you mean while "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" are NOT on the field. No, if the monster is destroyed by battle, then it will go to the Graveyard, where the Trap Card has no effect anymore.

if in case csg cant return to trap while jinzo/royal decree are out... will it return if jinzo/royal decree leave the field... lemme know plz.

As I stated earlier, when "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" hit the field, "Cyber Shadow Gardna" reverts back to just a Continuous Trap Card, with it's effect negated. If "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" leave the field, it will NOT once again become a monster card (Answered by the "Embodiment of Apophis" rulings); however, it's revert at end of opponent's turn effect will be active once again.

one more thing about the atk value... lets say i have gaia power out... lets say he has a 1500 atker... it'll become 2000... in main phase i activate csg which will become 2000 as the current atk value of the monster and get another 500 atk boost from gaia power becomming 2500 atk... is this statement true?

Yes, this statement is true. This is actually covered in the rulings for "Cyber Shadow Gardna".

 

[SirViper]

i edit my previous post to try to make it more clear in what im trying to find out... can you take another look please and see if there are any unanswered, thx.

 

[skey23]

a. jinzo/royal decree is present in end phase, will csg flip back down in fd trap mode or stay fu meaninglessly, like a coth after bringing back a monster that is later tributed?

Answered in previous post.

b. jinzo/royal decree aren't present in the end phase of either this or next turn... will csg be able to flip back down as a trap or is it a timing issue where it cant be flipped back down cuz its lost the timing by either having the effect negated or not being able to flip back down in the same turn it was flipped up due to jinzo/royal decree's presence.

Answered in previous post.

2. if csg dies in battle, in end phase does it flip back down in trap mode or will the trap go to gy.

Answered in previous post.

3. about the attack increase... if opp atks with a monster and then changes the attack values of either monster with something like shrink, limiter, rush recklessly... will csg automatically revert its stats to the newly modified stats? ie. if opps monster gains 700 atk with rush recklessly... with csg modify to gain that 700 as well? and if opp uses shrink on csg, will it modify back to the opps stats?

"Cyber Shadow Gardna" copies the ATK of the attacking monster only when it is initially determined to be the attack target. It does not continually adjust it's ATK/DEF. If you modify the ATK/DEF of the attacking monster anytime after the attack has been declared (such as during the Damage Step), then "Cyber Shadow Gardna" will not adjust.

 

[Digital Jedi]

well u didnt actually answer my questions...

1. if i activate csg in main phase, then royal decree/jinzo come in play... its effect gets negated... but in the same turn, in end phase what will happen if:


a. jinzo/royal decree is present in end phase, will csg flip back down in fd trap mode or stay fu meaninglessly, like a monster that was tributed after being brought back with coth?

If its effect is being negated, how could it possibly flip itself back face-down?

b. jinzo/royal decree aren't present in the end phase of either this or next turn... will cs be able to flip back down as a trap or is it a timing issue where it cant be flipped back down cuz its lost the timing by either having the effect negated or not being able to flip back down in the same turn it was flipped up due to jinzo/royal decree's presence.

It's not a timing issue, it's just not capable of doing anything anymore. It sits there meaninglessly. This is why Skey said to look at Embodiment of Apophis' rulings. Because their both the same.

2. if cs dies in battle, in end phase does it flip back down in trap mode or will the trap go to gy.

If it died during your Battle Phase, it's already in the Graveyard before you ever get to the End Phase. That's where monsters go when their destroyed.

3. about the attack increase... if opp atks with a monster and then changes the attack values of either monster with something like shrink, limiter, rush recklessly... will cs automatically revert its stats to the newly modified stats? ie. if opps monster gains 700 atk with rush recklessly... with cs modify to gain that 700 as well? and if opp uses shrink on cs, will it modify back to the opps stats?

It depends which monster is being affected and when. If the attacking monster's stats are changed, then Cyber Shadow will not get any boost if this happens AFTER the attack is declared. I already mentioned this in my Rush Recklessly example.

If Cyber Shadow is the one being affected, then it still depends on when. Affect it before the attack is declared, and it will erase any stats it had and "become" the ATK and DEF of the attacking monster, ignoring any stats it had before the attack was declared. Affect after the attack is declared and the stat will change starting with the copied ATK and DEF.


We actually did already answer these questions. Is there something in particular that you don't understand?

 

[Digital Jedi]

however, it's revert at end of opponent's turn effect will be active once again.

It will? I thought this was a Monster-to-Trap effect that doesn't work if it's back in trap form at the End Phase.

 

[skey23]

It's a Continuous Trap Card. It becomes a monster only when it is initially activated. The 'continuous' part is when it reverts back to a set Trap at the end of the turn. When "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" leave the field, that effect will once again be active. It's the same as if "Jinzo" was on the field when "Royal Decree" is active. If "Jinzo" leaves the field, "Royal Decree" will kick back in.

 

[Digital Jedi]

It's a Continuous Trap Card. It becomes a monster only when it is initially activated. The 'continuous' part is when it reverts back to a set Trap at the end of the turn. When "Jinzo" or "Royal Decree" leave the field, that effect will once again be active. It's the same as if "Jinzo" was on the field when "Royal Decree" is active. If "Jinzo" leaves the field, "Royal Decree" will kick back in.

It just made sense to me that if one part if the effect only works as a Monster Card, so should the other.

 

[SirViper]

ok well i guess now it makes sense... also can e-hero dark panther copy its effect? and if so, what are the limitations to what part it can actually copy. what about relinquished and thousand-eyes, can they make him an equip spell card? if so what happens at end phase... is the effect of copying monster stats given to csg by the trap itself or does csg turn into a monster with the effect to copy monster stats, in which case, can skill drain negate the copying effect? also if big bang is equipped to csg... will it be removed from play since big bang leaves the field? thx for taking the time to clarify these.

edit: more questions...
what happens to csg and the trap form csg if targetted by compulsory, interdimensional, book of moon.

 

[Digital Jedi]

also can e-hero dark panther copy its effect? and if so, what are the limitations to what part it can actually copy.

Dark Panther can copy any Monster Effect. It's just that not all Monster Effects are practical to copy. He would only practically be able to copy the ATK/DEF modifier of Cyber Shadow. After that, refer to the Dark Panther vs. Embodiment ruling:

You can target "Embodiment of Apophis" when it is a monster but only the card name will be copied. It does not have an effect to copy. "Neo-Spacian Dark Panther" will NOT be treated as a Trap Card.
​

In Cyber Shadow's case there is an effect to copy. The ATK/DEF modifier. But the properties that return it to a trap card will not usable.

what about relinquished and thousand-eyes, can they make him an equip spell card? if so what happens at end phase...

This is also covered in the Embodiment of Apophis rulings:

If "Embodiment of Apophis" is a monster and is equipped to "Relinquished", "Embodiment of Apophis" is treated as any other monster equipped to "Relinquished", and "Relinquished" gets 1600 ATK and 1800 DEF.​

Whatever stat it had when equipped is what Relinquished/TER will take on.

It can't return in the end phase, because it no longer has any effect.

is the effect of copying monster stats given to csg by the trap itself or does csg turn into a monster with the effect to copy monster stats, in which case, can skill drain negate the copying effect?

Cyber Shadow is both a Monster and a Trap Card for all intents and purposes once it has been successfully activated. The card becomes an Effect Monster (unlike Apophis, who becomes a Normal Monster), so it can be negated just like any other effect.

also if big bang is equipped to csg... will it be removed from play since big bang leaves the field?

Yes, it will be removed from play.

edit: more questions...
what happens to csg and the trap form csg if targetted by compulsory, interdimensional, book of moon.

Once again, refer to Embodiment of Apophis' rulings. It can be affected by either type of effect. Ones that affect Monsters and ones that affect traps. Each situation is covered there in one manner or another.

 

[Entropy]

Dark Panther can copy any Monster Effect. It's just that not all Monster Effects are practical to copy. He would only practically be able to copy the ATK/DEF modifier of Cyber Shadow. After that, refer to the Dark Panther vs. Embodiment ruling.

Um...

"¢ You can target "Embodiment of Apophis" when it is a monster but only the card name will be copied. It does not have an effect to copy. "Neo-Spacian Dark Panther" will NOT be treated as a Trap Card.

I always assumed that that was because Embodiment of Apophis was a Normal monster. Cyber Shadow Guardna becomes a Machine-type, not a Machine/Effect-type monster. Neo-Spacian Dark Panther shouldn't copy the ATK/DEF change.

 

[Digital Jedi]

Cyber Shadow Gardna
Activate only during your opponent's Main Phase. After activation, Special Summon this card; it is treated as an Effect Monster Card (Machine-Type/EARTH/Level 4/ATK ?/DEF ?). (This card is still treated as a Trap Card.) If this card is selected as an attack target, the ATK and DEF of this card become the ATK and DEF of the attacking monster. This card is Set in its Spell & Trap Card Zone during your opponent's End Phase.​

If you read a little further down that same post, you'll see where I mention that.

 

[Fury]

Just to be sure.

If Big Bang Shot is equipped to CSG and CSG reverts back to a trap at the End Phase, CSG will not be removed from play because it is no longer the target of Big Bang Shot.

 

[Tkwiget]

Just to be sure.

If Big Bang Shot is equipped to CSG and CSG reverts back to a trap at the End Phase, CSG will not be removed from play because it is no longer the target of Big Bang Shot.

Simply no. Because it's destroyed by a game mechanic rather than a card effect such as Dust Tornado or Mystical Space Typhoon. It has to be removed from the targetted monster while the monster is face up on the field in order to have its effect affect the monster in any way.

Also, you can't equip Big Bang Shot to Cyber Shadow Gardna since it won't ever produce a monster during your turn.

 

[Fury]

1. My sentence wasnt a question. I clarified the earlier question/answer.

2. That's not the point. Tailor of the Fickle