Kuriboh vs Injection Fairy Lily

[drzero7]

When does Kuriboh's hand discard effect activate? Like can it be activated during damage step?

Like say I have a blank field and my foe have Lily on his field and he attacks me directly. Do I have to discard Kuriboh before he uses it's "pay 2000LP during damage step" or can I discard Kuriboh after he pumped Lily to 3400ATK?

 

[skey23]

Yeah. It tells me that you make the damage that was just inflicted 0. You can't make it 0 if there wasn't any battle damage yet. That's where the rub is.

Hence my mention of both "Barrel Behind the Door" and "Ring of Defense". They both affect the Damage inflicted BEFORE it's ever calculated or inflicted.

 

[Tkwiget]

Yeah, I know what you mean.

"Kuriboh" is activated during damage calculation. If your opponent attacks with "Injection Fairy Lily" and activates her effect, you can chain "Kuriboh" to reduce the damage to zero.

[Re: Airknight Parshath] If the opponent activates "Waboku" or "Kuriboh" to reduce the Battle Damage to 0, you do not draw.


Hehehe.

 

[Kyhotae]

"Barrel Behind the Door" and "Ring of Defense" have very specific activation requirements...

Oh, and "Airknight Parshath" activates in sub-step 4. Are you trying to prove my point?

 

[Tkwiget]

"Barrel Behind the Door" and "Ring of Defense" have very specific activation requirements...

Oh, and "Airknight Parshath" activates in sub-step 4. Are you trying to prove my point?

No, actually I'm not.

But here's something you guys can munch on for the time being.

[Re: Damage Condenser] "Damage Condenser" is activated during the Damage Step immediately after you take battle damage. Because "Kuriboh" is activated before this (during damage calculation), you cannot discard "Kuriboh" to prevent damage and still activate "Damage Condenser" when taking damage for the same attack.

You cannot activate "Kuriboh" in a chain to "Nutrient Z"'s effect. The effect of "Kuriboh" would reduce the Battle Damage to 0, and then the effect of "Nutrient Z" will no longer increase you Life Points. You must actually take the damage to gain the benefit of "Nutrient Z"'s effect.

Enjoy! =)

 

[Kyhotae]

That doesn't prove much. "Damage Calculation" is divided into Sub-Step 3 and Sub-Step 4. Just because you activate it before "Damage Condenser" doesn't mean it's not just earlier in Sub-Step 4. It's just saying that you have to take the damage to activate "Damage Condenser" and "Kuriboh" is activated right when damage is taken, then it makes it 0. Once the damage is applied, then the timing for "Damage Condenser's" timing is correct. Since it's 0, then you're kind of stuck and can't activate it at all.

 

[ygo doc]

Wow, this thread has gone way beyond the teasing Skey23 and Kyhotae started...

First, I will not go against the UDE ruling on Kuriboh as posted by Simon. As far as I can tell, Kuriboh may be ACTIVATED anytime during battlephase from Start Step up until the end of Substep 3, calculate damage. The effect of Kuriboh appears to be APPLIED or RESOLVED at the very beginning of Substep 4, apply damage. Remember, Kuriboh doesn't protect any monsters from being destroyed; it only makes the Battle Damage inflicted to your Life Points 0 (zero). Damage is applied to the monster and then to the player. When Damage is applied to the player, it's reduced to zero!

Even though the Detailed Damage Step chart splits Calculate and Apply Damage into Part 1 and Part 2 Substeps, I see no easy way of distinguishing these substeps during tournament dueling. All veteran duelists know how to distinguish and specifically announce when they are in Damage Step. Unless a player expressly stated s/he has no further effects to activate or chain during the Calculate and Apply Damage Substep, I would let him/her activate Kuriboh.

I can understand the UDE ruling stating that Kuriboh's effect is chained to Injection Fairy Lily's effect, but I am quite certain that the activator of Kuriboh is always able to wait until after Injection Fairy Lily owner chooses to boost or not. I cannot visualize a scenario where IFL gets to boost her ATK, that prevents the NTP from activating Kuriboh. (OK, other than Prohibition)

doc

 

[masterwoo0]

To me, Kuriboh sounds an awful like Waboku without the "save your monster" effect, and it can be activated in the turn players Draw Phase, so what difference does it make when Kuriboh states that it can only be activated in the Battle Phase? It doesnt say, "Can only be activated if your opponent attacks"

The ruling later reads that Kuriboh can ONLY be activated during Damage Calculation. Why would it say that in the Ruling, when it plainly says it on the card that it is the Battle Phase (because the Battle Phase is the complete Start Step, Battle Step, Damage Step, and End Step. That's why, and if you wait to the End Step, it is too late to reduce the Damage to 0)?

I could see if they hadnt reprinted Kuriboh twice (Starter Deck 2006 and Dark Beginning), they could easily have changed the text to say it can only be activated during Damage Calculation, which OBVIOUSLY only occurs in the Battle Phase.

I think that it has a timing that allows it to be discarded after the attack is declared, but the effect itself will only be applied if there is Damage.

 

[Tkwiget]

That doesn't prove much. "Damage Calculation" is divided into Sub-Step 3 and Sub-Step 4. Just because you activate it before "Damage Condenser" doesn't mean it's not just earlier in Sub-Step 4. It's just saying that you have to take the damage to activate "Damage Condenser" and "Kuriboh" is activated right when damage is taken, then it makes it 0. Once the damage is applied, then the timing for "Damage Condenser's" timing is correct. Since it's 0, then you're kind of stuck and can't activate it at all.

You missed what the ruling is pointing out. It's pointing out that Kuriboh activates before you take Battle Damage. Taking Battle Damage is Part 2 of Damage Calculations; which is labeled "Apply Damage." ygo doc and Masterwoo0 explained this nicely for me.

You don't activate Kuriboh when you take Battle Damage, but rather when you're calculating the Battle Damage. You calculate damage and then reduce it to zero before you apply zero Battle Damage to the player. That's how I see the "Damage Condenser v.s. Kuriboh" ruling says to me. However, I'm not saying that your logic on the topic is flawed either Derek, just different; which as you know is something I like.