Nephthys Card Rulings.

B

Blaze

New Member
This is my first time here and I hope I can get some card answers cleared up because there are a few things bugging me. This one is all about Nephthys.
Please note: That I have searched but it didn't answer a few things.

Hand of Nephthys;
According to the public specific card rulings of UpperdeckEntertainment.com [ Link Provided for quick look: http://www.upperdeckentertainment.com/yugioh/en/faq_card_rulings.aspx?first=F&last=H ]

It states; "Tribute 2 monsters on your side of the field, including this card" means that you Tribute "Hand of Nephthys" plus 1 additional monster."

Apparently, I came across a quarrel with a few low level judges in a duel, (yes I dueled them); I had 1 monster out on the field and summoned Hand of Nephthys on the turn I was allowed to summon. I used it's effect to tribute the card and the other face up to special summon the Sacred Phoenix. These people claimed that I needed to tribute 2 monsters AND the Hand of Nephthys in order to successfully pull it off; because of this comma rule they follow. Where " , " means "and", but according to the official rulings on the website, it's meant different.

Conclusion, we had to end up flipping a coin to see whether I had to follow "the official rules" they were taught with or the "official rules" on the website. I won and continued but they claimed it was a false game. So now not only does my head hurt but I am desperately seeking for an answer here. Please help me out.

Secondly, Sacred Phoenix of Nephthys;
Is Tribute different from Destroyed? I would think I'd destroy the monster to bring out another in it's place, a sacrificial thing. Can Horn of Heaven activate Phoenix's effect and have it returned since it was by card effect and such?

Thanks in advance.

Edit:
b) Tribute Summon - When summoning a Monster level 5 or Higher, you must destroy 1 or more (specified) monster cards already on the field to Set the Tribute Monster. When you are summoning a monster level 5 or 6, you must destroy 1 monster. If you are summoning a monster level 7 or higher, you must destroy 2. A Tribute Summon is considered a Normal Summon.

I found this, I believe it's in the manual as well and such. But I ask to just verify to see if this is true.Ya'never know, right?
 
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Bigred Blues said:
What about Phoenix Special Summoning Vs Royal Oppression or Divine Wrath?
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"Phoenix" and "Divine Wrath" was answered in the new "Divine Wrath" rulings.

For "Royal Oppression", I think it's safe to use a 'similar' type monster, "Vampire Lord" for the answers. From the UDE FAQ:
"When "Vampire Lord" is Special Summoned by its effect, you can activate the effect of "Royal Oppression" to negate the Special Summon and destroy "Vampire Lord"."

Hope this helps!
 
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StRiKe_NiNjA said:
If Horn of Heaven negates the summon, the monster "never" makes it to the "field". However it's destroyed and will Special Summon during the following standby phase.

If you read carefully, I didn't state Horn of Heaven vs Sacred Phoenix of Nephthys when it is tribute summoned. I stated "Horn of Heaven vs Special Summon of the Phoenix".

And if you read ruling number 5, my reply has nothing to do with what I have previously posted.

Plus, Horn of Heaven cannot be activated in response to Sacred Phoenix of Nephthys Special Summoning itself to the field because an effect is resolving.
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If Horn of Heaven can not be activated due to an effect resolving, what effect is it?

If it is the "Heavy Storm" effect, why do the rulings make it look like it is a seperate effect that happens after the effect of being Special Summon resolves?

For reference I show "You can chain to the effect of "Sacred Phoenix of Nephthys" that destroys all Spell and Trap Cards"
That shows that it is an effect that activates and it is worded as though the "Heavy Storm" effect is seperated from the Special Summon.
 
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Bigred Blues said:
If Horn of Heaven can not be activated due to an effect resolving, what effect is it?

If it is the "Heavy Storm" effect, why do the rulings make it look like it is a seperate effect that happens after the effect of being Special Summon resolves?

For reference I show "You can chain to the effect of "Sacred Phoenix of Nephthys" that destroys all Spell and Trap Cards"
That shows that it is an effect that activates and it is worded as though the "Heavy Storm" effect is seperated from the Special Summon.
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Of course it is seperate.

You would chain Horn of Heaven to the Special Summon effect of Phoenix. It's not mechanically correct, but that's how Konami wants it.

You cannot chain Horn of Heaven to the "Heavy Storm effect" because you have missed timing.

You can chain Divine Wrath though, to either effect.
 
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You would chain Horn of Heaven to the Special Summon effect of Phoenix.
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Actually, you would "quick-respond". It's weird, I know, but you use Horn of Heaven some time between the start of the effect and the timing of Phoenix's second effect.

It's not mechanically correct, but that's how Konami wants it.
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Konami defines the mechanics. Everything they say is, by definition, mechanically correct.

It is up to us to figure out what those mechanics actually are.

Oh, and people, there are two A's in "separate".
 
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Actually, you would "quick-respond". It's weird, I know, but you use Horn of Heaven some time between the start of the effect and the timing of Phoenix's second effect.
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I highly doubt that, whatever you need to tell yourself to justify it.

Konami defines the mechanics. Everything they say is, by definition, mechanically correct.
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I completely disagree with this, i believe there are many cases where they (Konami) simply "make things fit" in order to solve a conflict, as there really are no solid mechanics for this game at all. One look at Vs. Comp Rulebook will show you just how little and far behind this game is in terms of mechanics.

Frankly Konami doesn't define mechanics at all, they give rulings. It's up to us to figure out and extrapolate the mechanics from that. It's pathetic really.
 
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All I am saying here is that Konami took two words that would be practically the same outcome and "De-Fusion" it into two seperate meanings of it's own.

To tribute a monster is to send it to the graveyard; since it was a living being on the field; the only way it can be sent to the graveyard is by destroying the monster. You killed it, you slaughtered it. To Tribute is to sacrifice for a higher God or such, to sacrifice is to destroy a living being.

So I figured, by logic; that you could chain Phoenix's effect to Tribute card effect such as Horn of Heaven. Making Phoenix the Tribute to stop another summoning as the card would require to activate.

However, since the rules of logic is played differently in this "World", then I was wrong in the alternate universe. La!
 
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krazykidpsx said:
actually a tribute and a destroy are not the same.

you offering it as a cost is not you destroying it.

you picking it as the target of Assault on GHQ now that is destroying it.
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In spite of the whole tribute does not equal destory being written in the rule book with the new structure decks I'd estimate that about 75-90% of duelists in my area don't know this and even worse some of the main Judges for the tournaments don't.
 
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