royal opression

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woltarr

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if i use the effct of "royal opression" to negate the effct of polymerization , the monsters are still sent to the grave?

or the monsters are sent to the grave when the card resolves?

also


if i use the effct of "royal opression" to negate the effct of "advanced art ritual" , the monsters are still sent to the grave?

PLMK


woltarr
 
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woltarr said:
if i use the effct of "royal opression" to negate the effct of polymerization , the monsters are still sent to the grave?

or the monsters are sent to the grave when the card resolves?

also



if i use the effct of "royal opression" to negate the effct of "advanced art ritual" , the monsters are still sent to the grave?

PLMK


woltarr
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According to the Macro Cosmos ruling, Polymerization has no cost.

[info2]You can activate "Polymerization" while "Macro Cosmos" is active on the field because sending Fusion Material Monsters to the Graveyard is an effect of "Polymerization" and not a cost.[/info2]

I've not seen anything on Advanced Ritual Art yet, but it doesn't read like a cost to me.
 
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err so if i negate polimerization , the oponent still has to send the monsters to the grave?

since it is not cost and part of the effct when i send the monsters?

and about advanced art ritual or any ritaul card? when i send the monsters to grave?

wolatrr
 
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No, the opponent doesn't have to send anything if the sending is part of the effect. The reason costs can't be refunded is because they happen before the effect is added to the chain. If it's not a cost, then it doesn't happen until the effect resolves. If you negate the effect, it doesn't resolve. So they're not sent.
 
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Digital Jedi said:
No, the opponent doesn't have to send anything if the sending is part of the effect. The reason costs can't be refunded is because they happen before the effect is added to the chain. If it's not a cost, then it doesn't happen until the effect resolves. If you negate the effect, it doesn't resolve. So they're not sent.
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so when we talk about polimerization , the monsters are no sent to the grave..ok

and about ritual cards? the monsters used in the ritual ( imagining that they are on the field) will be send to the grave anyway?

or in other words : send the monsters to the grave is a cost to ritual summon or they are part do effct as well?

woltarr
 
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Ritual Spell Cards have no Cost. Everything that's written on them happens as their effect (i.e. both the Tributing and the Summoning).

When a card's activation is negated, the Cost (which has already been spent by the time Royal Oppression or something is activated) is not refunded, because it's already happened and been done.

Ritual Spell Cards and Polymerization have no Costs. Therefore, if they are negated, all that happens is that Ritual Spell Card or Polymerization is lost. The monsters that would be Tributed are not affected.
 
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What about the monster that was about to be summoned? Since Royal Oppression says " destroy both", would it hit the graveyard from the extra deck ( fusions ) or the hand ( rituals ) ?
 
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[info]Example 1: If "Marauding Captain" is Normal Summoned, its effect activates. You can chain to this effect by activating the effect of "Royal Oppression". The effect of "Marauding Captain" is negated, no monster is Special Summoned, and the "Marauding Captain" is destroyed. (The monster your opponent intended to Special Summon with the effect of "Marauding Captain" remains in his hand.)[/info]Follow the rules for chain resolution. If the effect that Special Summons is negated and destroyed before it gets it's turn to resolve on the chain, then there's not going to be any monster on the field to "destroy both".
 
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In other words, no, the Ritual Monster or Fusion Monster is not affected, and it will stay in your hand/Extra Deck. Only Polymerization (or similar) or the Ritual Spell Card would be destroyed.
 
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Sorry to bump this thread, but the question I have is royal oppression related.

My first question involves RO with lava golem. If my opponent has RO on the field and I attempt to summon lava golem, are the monsters i select as tributes still tributed if he/she chooses to apply RO's effect? What my friends and I are having trouble with is that we are not sure if the effect of RO would apply to the effect of lava golem or the actual summoning of it. Does it chain to the effect or does it respond to the summon?

Next scenario is Marauding Captain. RO says, "Pay 800 Life Points to negate a Special Summon of a monster and the effect of a card that Special Summons a monster and destroy it. Both you and your opponent can use this effect as long as this card remains face-up on the field." (taken from the wikia). Also from the wikia, it says, "If "Marauding Captain" is Normal Summoned, its effect activates. You can chain to this effect by activating the effect of "Royal Oppression". The effect of "Marauding Captain" is negated, no monster is Special Summoned, and the "Marauding Captain" is destroyed. (The monster your opponent intended to Special Summon with the effect of "Marauding Captain" remains in his hand.)". My question regarding this is, would it be more practical to apply the effect of RO to the monster that was special summoned by Marauding Captain's effect so that it would destroy the special summoned monster AND Marauding Captain? This under the assumption that when RO states to "destroy both", it means the monster special summoned and the card that special summoned it.
 
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Second question first. Royal Oppression must be chained to the activation of the effect that would Special Summon the Monster. In the case of Maurading Captain, if you wait for the Monster to be Special Summoned, you would be attepting to activate an effect during the resolution of Maurading Captain's effect. You cannot do that. RO must be added to the chain (this ain't M:TG ;-D), befroe things start to resolve.

As for Lava Golem, Fusions that occur by the effect of the fusion monster (Glad Beasts, XYZ, Hero's, etc. - often mis-nomered "contact" fusions) and Syncro Monsters; the cards used are considered sent to the graveyard as if by cost (I'm choosing my words carefully here), therefore, the cards are in the GY (removed from Play, returned to Deck, whatever) and the monster that would be Special Summoned is destroyed as surely as if you tried to Normal Tribute Summon a Monster and it got Solemned. These are all inherent Special Summons and are negated by Royal Oppression in the same manner that Solemn and the Horns negate. Don't be confused by the sending part.

Hope that helps.
 
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It might also be noted that if Lava Golem's special summon is negated, a player may not normal summon or set this turn as per Lava Golem's instructions. It's not a ruling I agree with but one that has been made <shrug>
 
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DarkLogicianOfCaos said:
Second question first. Royal Oppression must be chained to the activation of the effect that would Special Summon the Monster. In the case of Maurading Captain, if you wait for the Monster to be Special Summoned, you would be attepting to activate an effect during the resolution of Maurading Captain's effect. You cannot do that. RO must be added to the chain (this ain't M:TG ;-D), befroe things start to resolve.

As for Lava Golem, Fusions that occur by the effect of the fusion monster (Glad Beasts, XYZ, Hero's, etc. - often mis-nomered "contact" fusions) and Syncro Monsters; the cards used are considered sent to the graveyard as if by cost (I'm choosing my words carefully here), therefore, the cards are in the GY (removed from Play, returned to Deck, whatever) and the monster that would be Special Summoned is destroyed as surely as if you tried to Normal Tribute Summon a Monster and it got Solemned. These are all inherent Special Summons and are negated by Royal Oppression in the same manner that Solemn and the Horns negate. Don't be confused by the sending part.

Hope that helps.
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Hello again, I just thought up an example that I want to ask. If a monster special summoned via Marauding Captain is successful, would royal oppresion not work in the same way bottomless trap hole work in the scenario? I mean, BTH doesn't chain, but responds to a summon, so could Royal oppresion not respond to the resolution of marauding captain's effect? I'm only asking because in the resolution to MC's effect, the last thing to happen is the special summon of a monster, so "responding" (not chaining) to it with BTH would make it seem that royal Oppression would work in a similar fashion. Let me know if anything here is incorrect. Thanks.
 
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"Royal Oppression" either negates the Summon, or the effect of a card which Special Summons. If you wait for the Summon to be successful, then it is too late to negate it. If the effect of "Marauding Captain" to resolves and Special Summons the monster, then the Summon is already successful, so "Royal Oppression" can't be activated.

"Bottomless Trap Hole" is activated after the Summon is successful. The two aren't really comparable.

"Royal Oppression" is kinda like "Magic Jammer". If you wait for "Monster Reborn" to resolve correctly and to Special Summon the monster, then it's too late to use "Magic Jammer" to negate "Monster Reborn".
 
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