Torrential Tribute

[Oskar Darktide]

Ok then, if I summon and my opponent were to play a card, could I then play Torrential Tribute? I've looked around and haven't found anything. I know that Bottomless Trap Hole must be played to the summoning of the monster, but I haven't seen anything saying this about Torrential Tribute.

 

[chaosruler]

If you mean by your opponent "playing" a card as responding, then yes, because the last thing to actually occur was the summon of your monster

-chaosruler

 

[densetsu_x]

You summon, you have priority (assuming no other chain starts automatically). You could activate "Torrential Tribute" first with said priority. Of course your opponent could then activate "Bottomless Trap Hole" in a chain. You'd have to wait to see if he'd respond. If he doesm you can chain with TT. Of course if you wait, and he does nothing, you missed your window.

 

[ancient_duelist]

You summon, you have priority (assuming no other chain starts automatically). You could activate "Torrential Tribute" first with said priority. Of course your opponent could then activate "Bottomless Trap Hole" in a chain.

Is this correct? I thought priority only applied to effects already active on the field. This is from Michael Palmer's version 2.0 article on priority:

Now, does this mean that Player A could activate something like "Pot of Greed" with turn priority? We don't know, but my guess is no based on the fact that to limit the use of priority only to the effects present on the field at that time during the chain of events makes more sense then to be able to activate any card in the game at that time.

I agree with Michael here and I don't think the turn player can use priority to activate Spell or Trap cards until after the opponent has the opportunity to respond to the summoning of a Monster.

You'd have to wait to see if he'd respond. If he does you can chain with TT. Of course if you wait, and he does nothing, you missed your window.

This, I think, is the correct answer to the original question.

 

[densetsu_x]

Actually, if you look at the rulings for "Pineapple Blast", you would use said Priority to activate that immediately as a response to the summon. Since the timing for that trap card is "a successful normal summon", by extrapolation you would have the same chance to activate "Torrential Tribute" first immediately after summoning too. You as the turn player have first crack to respond to your own summon.

And (assuming there's not triggered response) as the turn player, you can activate Ignition Effects, Multi-Trigger Effects, Spell Speed 2 S/T cards, and Spell Speed 3 Trap cards after a successful summon (should you want to) before the opponent can respond. He can then either respond to the summon or respond to the effect/spell/trap that was activated.

 

[ancient_duelist]

Actually, if you look at the rulings for "Pineapple Blast", you would use said Priority to activate that immediately as a response to the summon. Since the timing for that trap card is "a successful normal summon", by extrapolation you would have the same chance to activate "Torrential Tribute" first immediately after summoning too. You as the turn player have first crack to respond to your own summon.

I have to disagree with this extrapolation. The timing for Pineapple Blast is not "a successful normal summon" it is "You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully." I believe it is the effect of Pineapple Blast that allows it to go first on the chain before Trap Hole. I think trying to use this ruling to claim the turn player has priority to respond to their own summon is not justified.

And (assuming there's not triggered response) as the turn player, you can activate Ignition Effects, Multi-Trigger Effects, Spell Speed 2 S/T cards, and Spell Speed 3 Trap cards after a successful summon (should you want to) before the opponent can respond. He can then either respond to the summon or respond to the effect/spell/trap that was activated.

I have never seen this stated anywhere and I do not believe this is correct. What is your source for this?

 

[masterwoo0]

I have to disagree with this extrapolation. The timing for Pineapple Blast is not "a successful normal summon" it is "You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully."

Okaaaaaay. You say to-may-to, I say to-mah-to. If there a real difference between the two??

"This card can only be activated when a monster is Normal Summoned."

A successful normal summon is pretty much a hard thing to stop, being as there are only 2 cards (3, if you count "Non Aggression Area) out there that will prevent it from happening.

So, lets say that the opponent has neither, for ease of explanation.

 

[densetsu_x]

I have to disagree with this extrapolation. The timing for Pineapple Blast is not "a successful normal summon" it is "You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully." I believe it is the effect of Pineapple Blast that allows it to go first on the chain before Trap Hole. I think trying to use this ruling to claim the turn player has priority to respond to their own summon is not justified.

"You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully." If that doesn't mean the timing to activate the card is a "successful normal summon", I don't know what is. Further, it goes first on the chain because you ACTIVATE it first BEFORE your opponent responds. Effects do not "magically" shift on a chain.

As for what can be activated, it's already been long established (again, presuming there's no Triggered chain) that Ignition and Multi-Trigger effects can be activated immediately. Likewise Counter Traps can be activated any time (yes you could "Solemn Judgment" your own summon if you wanted to). And yes, Normal Trap cards can be activated as well ("Pineapple Blast", "Torrential Tribute", "Trap Hole", etc.) So that only leaves Quickplay Spell Cards as the only "leap of faith" here, which though I seem to recall also fitting the mold when we had the long priority debate in the first place.

 

[ancient_duelist]

Okaaaaaay. You say to-may-to, I say to-mah-to. If there a real difference between the two??

There is a real difference between ""You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully." and "This card can only be activated when a monster is Normal Summoned."

 

[masterwoo0]

There is a real difference between ""You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully." and "This card can only be activated when a monster is Normal Summoned."

But what I'm trying to get across to you is that you cant have one, without the other.

If I summon "Skull Servant" in face-up attack, you only have 2 choices of a response to make that summon unsuccessful:

Horn of Heaven
Solemn Judgment

Anything else is a response to a successful summon.

 

[DaGuyWitBluGlasses]

There is a real difference between ""You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully." and "This card can only be activated when a monster is Normal Summoned."

There's no difference. If the summon is not successful that means the summon was negated. If the summon was negated that means it never happened. If the summon never happened that means that there is NO normal summon for anything to respond to.

 

[densetsu_x]

The difference is that one is active tense and the other is passive tense. Besides that, saying you summoned anything "successfully" is redundant. Unless it was negated with "Solemn Judgment" and the like, EVERY summon is "successful". If you reach the point where you can activate say "Trap Hole", then the summon was already successful.

 

[ancient_duelist]

"You can only activate this card when you Normal Summon a monster successfully." If that doesn't mean the timing to activate the card is a "successful normal summon", I don't know what is.

My point is that Pineapple Blast can not be activated in response to any "successful normal summon" because it is restricted to "your" normal summon. It is not the same as Trap Hole/Bottomless Trap Hole.

Further, it goes first on the chain because you ACTIVATE it first BEFORE your opponent responds. Effects do not "magically" shift on a chain.

My point is that you are allowed to activate it first because its effect says you can activate it when you successfully normal summon a monster. I don't think this can be used to extrapolate that you have the priority to respond to your own summon before your opponent.

As for what can be activated, it's already been long established (again, presuming there's no Triggered chain) that Ignition and Multi-Trigger effects can be activated immediately.

If they are on the field, yes.

Likewise Counter Traps can be activated any time (yes you could "Solemn Judgment" your own summon if you wanted to). And yes, Normal Trap cards can be activated as well ("Pineapple Blast", "Torrential Tribute", "Trap Hole", etc.) So that only leaves Quickplay Spell Cards as the only "leap of faith" here, which though I seem to recall also fitting the mold when we had the long priority debate in the first place.

This is where I disagree. Other than for effects already on the field, I believe the opponent has the right to respond to a summon before the turn player can activate Traps, Counter Traps, or Quickplay Spell Cards following the summon. I have never seen anything that says the turn player can use priority to activate these cards following a summon and before the opponent is given the chance to respond to the summon.

 

[densetsu_x]

Priority, simply put, is the right for the turn player to act first.

My opponent can still "respond" to my summon (if possible: See "Exiled Force") but I have the right to go first as the turn player. Having "Pineapple Blast" set on the field doesn't give me the right to activate it before my opponent can do anything. All it dictates is WHEN it can be activated. Same with "Torrential Tribute", "Bottomless Trap Hole", "Trap Hole", etc. I still retain priority after the summon to do something first. So if I want to go ahead and TT the field, that is my choice. Feel free to chain BTH to it and make my guy be removed from play instead. If I wanted to I could "Trap Hole" my monster (say I had "Last Will" previously activated), see my opponent chain "Book of Moon" to prevent that from happening, only to then chain "Pineapple Blast". The timing is still correct. I normal summoned a monster (the last event to occur since the chain hasn't resolved). But look, it's 3rd on the chain. Or say "Stumbling" is on the field... I lose priority then so now my opponent can chain to the triggered response. I could still drop "Pineapple Blast" at this time. But, I only lost priority in a triggered sequence. Otherwise I am more than free to decided what I want to do first, if anything.

 

[Chillout1984]

Priority, simply put, is the right for the turn player to act first.

My opponent can still "respond" to my summon (if possible: See "Exiled Force") but I have the right to go first as the turn player. Having "Pineapple Blast" set on the field doesn't give me the right to activate it before my opponent can do anything. All it dictates is WHEN it can be activated. Same with "Torrential Tribute", "Bottomless Trap Hole", "Trap Hole", etc. I still retain priority after the summon to do something first. So if I want to go ahead and TT the field, that is my choice. Feel free to chain BTH to it and make my guy be removed from play instead. If I wanted to I could "Trap Hole" my monster (say I had "Last Will" previously activated), see my opponent chain "Book of Moon" to prevent that from happening, only to then chain "Pineapple Blast". The timing is still correct. I normal summoned a monster (the last event to occur since the chain hasn't resolved). But look, it's 3rd on the chain. Or say "Stumbling" is on the field... I lose priority then so now my opponent can chain to the triggered response. I could still drop "Pineapple Blast" at this time. But, I only lost priority in a triggered sequence. Otherwise I am more than free to decided what I want to do first, if anything.

You make 1 mistake: Trap Hole must be activated in response to a Normal or Flip summon of your opponent, it can't be used on your own summon

 

[densetsu_x]

Good point on that... um... I'm just following the the "Fiend Skull Dragon" example here... yeah that's the ticket. (2 references to "Fiend Skull Dragon" in 1 day... popular Fusion today).

 

[Xeno]

Well that an fun read! lol. Haven't laughed this much since that darkpaladin guy got pwnd off the board.

 

[Digital Jedi]

LOL. All this could have been easily settled by looking at the Pineapple Blast rulings:

If you Summon a monster and want to activate "Pineapple Blast", and your opponent wants to use "Trap Hole", "Pineapple Blast" is Step 1 of the chain and "Trap Hole" is Step 2.

 

[Raijinili]

Unless you pass priority and let your opponent use Trap Hole first.

 

[daivahataka]

Priority, simply put, is the right for the turn player to act first.

My opponent can still "respond" to my summon (if possible: See "Exiled Force") but I have the right to go first as the turn player. Having "Pineapple Blast" set on the field doesn't give me the right to activate it before my opponent can do anything. All it dictates is WHEN it can be activated. Same with "Torrential Tribute", "Bottomless Trap Hole", "Trap Hole", etc. I still retain priority after the summon to do something first. So if I want to go ahead and TT the field, that is my choice. Feel free to chain BTH to it and make my guy be removed from play instead. If I wanted to I could "Trap Hole" my monster (say I had "Last Will" previously activated), see my opponent chain "Book of Moon" to prevent that from happening, only to then chain "Pineapple Blast". The timing is still correct. I normal summoned a monster (the last event to occur since the chain hasn't resolved). But look, it's 3rd on the chain. Or say "Stumbling" is on the field... I lose priority then so now my opponent can chain to the triggered response. I could still drop "Pineapple Blast" at this time. But, I only lost priority in a triggered sequence. Otherwise I am more than free to decided what I want to do first, if anything.

Think it is a case that you only have priority to activate the effect of a card which is already on the field immediately after you summon though since:

QUESTION:
Well, I never knew that. But I have a question about this same topic:
Can I summon a monster (Archfiend Soldier) and then use Pot of Greed before they
can activate Torrential Tribute???
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ANSWER:
No you cannot.

Kevin Tewart
Game Developer
UDE Yu-Gi-Oh! TCG R&D Lead
Upper Deck Entertainment