Jinzo and RFDD

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frostmonarch

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If Jinzo is special summoned by the use of Return from a Different Dimension, will he be returned to out-of-play when that turn ends or will he stay on the field like Elemental Hero Wildheart? Also, if he does stay on the field for the next turn, does that mean that the rest of the monsters that were brought with him to the field will stay there as well, seeing as how he would then be negating the effects of trap cards?

Thanks
 
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"Jinzo" will still be removed from play at the end of the turn. He cannot negate the effect of a Trap card that has already resolved. As such, the monsters that were Special Summoned with him would also be removed as well, provided they are still 'conntected' to the effect.
 
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Thanks for the replies. However, the first person who replied is wrong about one thing, there is at least one card that will not be affected by RFDD's lingering effect, and that card is Elemental Hero Wildheart. the ruling on the UDE website specificially says that and I quote

You can Special Summon "Elemental Hero Wildheart" with "Return from the Different Dimension" and it will not be removed from play during the End Phase.


Thanks for the updates though.
 
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I'm never wrong. :p

There is no card capable of negating lingering effects. Once these cards have resolved, their effects cannot be negated. Elemental Hero Wildheart is UNAFFECTED by trap cards. He doesn't negate them, he simply ignores their effect. Crucial difference.

*sticks butt in skey's face*
 
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frostmonarch said:
Thanks for the replies. However, the first person who replied is wrong about one thing, there is at least one card that will not be affected by RFDD's lingering effect, and that card is Elemental Hero Wildheart. the ruling on the UDE website specificially says that and I quote

You can Special Summon "Elemental Hero Wildheart" with "Return from the Different Dimension" and it will not be removed from play during the End Phase.


Thanks for the updates though.
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We're not so sure that it's the lingering effect that Wildheart is ignoring...it may very well have something to do with Wildheart being involved in the activation of Rfdd....and it's anyone's guess at this point as Konami / UDE aren't responding to many questions regarding Elemental Hero Wildheart.
 
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and it's anyone's guess at this point
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I disagree. *points at above post*

I'm fairly confident in that answer. Think of it like RftDD is a sandstorm, most monsters are sand, but Wildheart is a boulder. He doesn't stop the sandstorm, and the sand still gets blown around. But HE doesn't. He just stands there, unaffected by the storm. Looking macho, and thinking he's cool. What a jerk. <grumbles>
 
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The problem is, we can sit back and say, "Lets wait until we get official word", but you know what? People actually PLAY with Elemental Hero Wildheart!! So, there needs to at least be a consensus as far as who agrees with or does not agree with. You cant have the majority of Judges who visit this site saying one thing, and ruling another way.

Its not like we're talking about a card that will more than likely only be used on YVD, like, "Des Volstgalph".
 
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I know and I do agree with that, though how can we really come to a concensus?? I for one don't agree that Wildheart can attack under Threatning Roar.
 
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I must concur with Jason. We have precedent already with the Burst Stream/Blue Eyes/Non-Spellcasting ruling. This is simply a matter of not affected meaning not affected.
 
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To be honest, it is a form of negation, it is a personal negation like a forcefield. But i see the issue lying more with what exactly "negate" means in the context of Jinzo.

Jinzo "negates" 2 ways, initial resolution, and effects generated (either activated or continuous) from card that are face-up, while he is face-up.

Wildheart's "unaffected" effect has no such restrictions, and will prevent (which is technically very close to negate), any effect generated from a Trap Card (past or present), that tries to specifically affect him, and only his part of the effect.

I believe the Non-Spellcasting ruling for Creature Swap actually uses the word "negate" when the "unaffected" monsters prevent the switch.

"While "Non-Spellcasting Area" is active, and only one player has Effect Monsters on the field, you can activate "Creature Swap" but its effect will be negated because none of the non-Effect Monsters can switch control due to a Spell Card's effect."

Overall, the "unaffected" power is definately an interesting one, and hard to wrap the brain around...i don't even think Konami has fully thought it through... probably why they refuse to answer inquiries about it.
 
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Non-Spellcasting/Creature Swap defeats the effect because the normal monster is not a valid target. The Burst Stream ruling is much more analogous to the RFTDD as both are residual effects being ignored instead of a currently resolving effect failing.

Jinzo is a Preventer as well as a Negator. As long as he is face-up on the field and his continuous effect is active you can't Activate any Trap Card (Preventer). Also once his continuous effect has kicked in he will immediately negate the effects of any Continuous Trap Card on the field (except for Skill Drain of course) as well as any trap card that resolves past the point where his effect has kicked in.

Wildheart is much simpler, he just is not affected by Traps. No true negation happens, he simply ignores the effects.

So if you were to use Rope of Life on Wildheart he would not gain the ATK boost. But if you return Jinzo with Rope of Life he does gain the ATK boost because his negation effect is not coming into play until after Rope of Life has already resolved.
 
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anthonyj said:
Non-Spellcasting/Creature Swap defeats the effect because the normal monster is not a valid target. The Burst Stream ruling is much more analogous to the RFTDD as both are residual effects being ignored instead of a currently resolving effect failing.

Jinzo is a Preventer as well as a Negator. As long as he is face-up on the field and his continuous effect is active you can't Activate any Trap Card (Preventer). Also once his continuous effect has kicked in he will immediately negate the effects of any Continuous Trap Card on the field (except for Skill Drain of course) as well as any trap card that resolves past the point where his effect has kicked in.

Wildheart is much simpler, he just is not affected by Traps. No true negation happens, he simpler ignores the effects.

So if you were to use Rope of Life on Wildheart he would not gain the ATK boost. But if you return Jinzo with Rope of Life he does gain the ATK boost because his negation effect is not coming into play until after Rope of Life has already resolved.
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jeez how difficult.
 
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