What to do?

[krazykidpsx]

Guys, I'm not suggesting we penalize a player because he's good. I'm suggesting we give other players a chance to win besides him. It doesn't really look like these guys are hurting in the skill/luck department. What is waiting a week going to do other then give someone else a chance at winning a prize? I'm not saying ban the guy from ever playing again. Just make the winner step aside for a time. It's not like he can't play in any other event.

I'm sorry guys, I cannot agree with you here. I sometimes cannot get to the shop for months on end. And when I do, I seldom have the measly five bucks to even participate in an event if they have one. It's hit or miss if I'm going to run into the Vs. players or the Yu-Gi players. Even so, I'm still a average duelist by most standards. I cannot even conceive how having to wait a week equates to being penalized. We talk all the time about fostering good sportsmanship and mutual respect among players. If you can't stand aside for one week at a time to let lesser experienced players have a taste of a victory, that is apparently no big accomplishment on your part, once in while, then what kind of sportsman are you? What are we suggesting when we say that not letting you win every week is discriminatory? "I'm good, so I must always have the cash prize"?

then how can you say you beat the best? if the best isnt around.

see, thats what competition is for, to be able to compete against the best not against a bunch of players whom' skill level is in par as yours, all that relies in is the luck factor. which overall its again going back to traditional were it was who got the best beat out there first.

which me personally dont think is good at all.

I completly understand what you mean, "let everybody have their 15min of fame" and while yes that is kool and all it doesnt mean anything anymore.

because eventually everybody will be a winner and nobody a loser. and while yes everybody wishes to be a winner and not a loser how can you say you beat the best to trully say you won with your skill and determination.

if we talk about good sportmanship we also talk about beating the best, becuase If we were to watch an Archery Tournament and all the players are good we would end up watching a Novice tournament, and if in the novice tournament there were all good aswell we would watch the Jr. Division which in turn we end up watching nothing cuase some of the Jr. are very very talented.

so over all its either we watch fierce tough competition or watch nothing cause everybody will be at home letting somebody win.

but i totally understand you DJ, it took me months before I won a Yugi tournament, and i could only bring it up becuase i went up against the best decks at the time. If i would have ended up playing a bunch of casual decks it wouldnt have ment anything.

During drafts, [for magic] I dont really go around saying, "ya i won, yea i won"
far from it, infact i use thouse drafts as training for more Competative drafts. I play with the same bunch all the time, I know what they pick and they usually dont know what im going to pick and there are reason for this. During drafts i have 2 options, make a experimental draft using the worse cards in the packs or making the winning deck with the threats.

Usually depending on the week I go 1 or the other, say i didnt want to win one week and let somebody else get better at their draft i would oviously pass the goods and push them to take them, If they dont it show how much skill they have at deck building, If they do, then good they will oviously win.

I take the time to study sets, completly and find the better cards. if by a bunch of commons that are 66 i find that 20 of them are really good, im oviously going to hope and get thouse card during draft, i know that Uncommon will be harder because there are only 3 per pack and there are 66 Uncommon's depending on the set. So i find out what the better uncommons are, and hope that i get one of them since the odds are far from me. then for rares there will only be a hand full of rares beign passed, so i try and hope to get one of the better rares in all the packs.

Sometimes if had the same rare passed to me 2 times. That oviously gives me the sign that nobody is running the color or support for the card. So its a take or leave situation.

In yugi most of the times since the packs are "fixed" most of the players just rare draft. This is not good, becuase you 1. get no experience 2. cheat your self out of making a good deck and ultimatly winning more packs. or what ever the case may be.

Dj since you rarely get to play as much as most of us, its understandable that you have to go through heck in order to end up in a stump, but if you were in the same boat as our selves were you are constanly playing you would probably be able to see ourside of the image and be leaning towards why we suggest the things we do.

Trust me, when you are cought spending over 15-30 dollars per week on just tournaments thats when people start looking at you with that face expression that say, "this guy is crazy, wasting his money on crap". thats not even counting how much the person spends on cards alone. if i told you how much money ive spent this entire month knowing i had no income you would be like, "dude your freaken dumb, set your priorities then play"

 

[Digital Jedi]

then how can you say you beat the best? if the best isnt around.

see, thats what competition is for, to be able to compete against the best not against a bunch of players whom' skill level is in par as yours, all that relies in is the luck factor. which overall its again going back to traditional were it was who got the best beat out there first.

which me personally dont think is good at all.

I think your missing the point, Krazy. "The best" will still be playing on a regular basis. They simply wont be playing every week IF they won the week before. We are only talking about an increasingly hypothetical 1 or 2 players here.

I completly understand what you mean, "let everybody have their 15min of fame" and while yes that is kool and all it doesnt mean anything anymore.

because eventually everybody will be a winner and nobody a loser. and while yes everybody wishes to be a winner and not a loser how can you say you beat the best to trully say you won with your skill and determination.

Limiting players to only win once a week does not prevent you from playing the best. Your still playing the same guys every week. It's only the guy(s) who won last week who don't get to play this week. There is no guarantee that everybody is going to get chance to win. It only offers a better opportunity. You act like if these guys win they will never be allowed to compete again. If I can wait 6 months before I get ANY chance to play another human being, then regular competitors can wait a week before they get to play in a local tourney. Again, this is only if they win that week.

if we talk about good sportmanship we also talk about beating the best, becuase If we were to watch an Archery Tournament and all the players are good we would end up watching a Novice tournament, and if in the novice tournament there were all good aswell we would watch the Jr. Division which in turn we end up watching nothing cuase some of the Jr. are very very talented.

Good sportsmanship has nothing to do with how good you are at playing. Good sportsmanship has to do with the WAY you play. You demeanor, your ability to win or loose graciously. It has nothing to do with being a skilled player or a poor player. It has to do with conduct.

so over all its either we watch fierce tough competition or watch nothing cause everybody will be at home letting somebody win.

Again, where are you getting this idea? It's only a one week wait, and that would only be if you won. If you don't win you don't wait.

but i totally understand you DJ, it took me months before I won a Yugi tournament, and i could only bring it up becuase i went up against the best decks at the time. If i would have ended up playing a bunch of casual decks it wouldnt have ment anything.

That keeps getting brought up. Again, I say, you'll still be playing tough competitors. Just for one week, someone will be given a chance at not getting knocked out the first round. You forget these local tourneys are not Swiss Rounds. How is a player going to get experience if every week he's matched up against the guy who won last week? It would be nice if that player could get a little more time at some competitive rounds every once in a while. Otherwise, why show up?

During drafts, [for magic] I dont really go around saying, "ya i won, yea i won"
far from it, infact i use thouse drafts as training for more Competative drafts. I play with the same bunch all the time, I know what they pick and they usually dont know what im going to pick and there are reason for this. During drafts i have 2 options, make a experimental draft using the worse cards in the packs or making the winning deck with the threats.

Usually depending on the week I go 1 or the other, say i didnt want to win one week and let somebody else get better at their draft i would oviously pass the goods and push them to take them, If they dont it show how much skill they have at deck building, If they do, then good they will oviously win.

I take the time to study sets, completly and find the better cards. if by a bunch of commons that are 66 i find that 20 of them are really good, im oviously going to hope and get thouse card during draft, i know that Uncommon will be harder because there are only 3 per pack and there are 66 Uncommon's depending on the set. So i find out what the better uncommons are, and hope that i get one of them since the odds are far from me. then for rares there will only be a hand full of rares beign passed, so i try and hope to get one of the better rares in all the packs.
Sometimes if had the same rare passed to me 2 times. That oviously gives me the sign that nobody is running the color or support for the card. So its a take or leave situation.

In yugi most of the times since the packs are "fixed" most of the players just rare draft. This is not good, becuase you 1. get no experience 2. cheat your self out of making a good deck and ultimatly winning more packs. or what ever the case may be.

That's all well and good, but as I said before, draft isn't everyone's cup of tea.

Dj since you rarely get to play as much as most of us, its understandable that you have to go through heck in order to end up in a stump, but if you were in the same boat as our selves were you are constanly playing you would probably be able to see ourside of the image and be leaning towards why we suggest the things we do.

Trust me, when you are cought spending over 15-30 dollars per week on just tournaments thats when people start looking at you with that face expression that say, "this guy is crazy, wasting his money on crap". thats not even counting how much the person spends on cards alone. if i told you how much money ive spent this entire month knowing i had no income you would be like, "dude your freaken dumb, set your priorities then play"

The fact that I don't get to play often makes me more appreciative of when I do. I cannot feel pity for a person who can't enter this week's tourney because he won last weeks. He'll get to play again next week and win again. Poor guy. If your winning every single week I think you'll live if one week passes before you can win again. I don't see how that's unfair, especially since less experienced player are getting constantly knocked out in round 1. The only other option that doesn't involve draft is letting these guys win every single week and the less experienced players don't show up at all.

 

[masterwoo0]

Like I said DJ, "Good Sportsmanship" means losing well also. If you get knocked down, you get back up. You dont crawl away with your tail between your legs like a whipped dog.

If you lose, and then quit because you feel like you cant beat the best, you admit defeat, and then accept the "helping hand" that takes away the best player for a week, so that you can take your tail and start wagging it again.

That's like saying, "If you win the Super Bow 2 years in a row, you cannot go back the next year!" That's not the "Spirit of Competition". Unless the Tournament is designed to specifically eliminate each weekly winner (but still offer a chance for another tournament to play in), it is not fair since if that is what I look forward to doing each week, now I have to stay home, not by choice, but because Im scaring off weaker players. That's just not cool at all. You dont understand because you play infrequently. If I could play more than once in a great while, I would. I used to drive weekly to a Single Elimination Tourney that was 45 minutes away, lose the first match in less than 40 minutes, and be on my way home 2-3 minutes later, barely having left my house for more than 2 hours, and I'm on my way back home again.

The first time I made it to the Finals, was like a "Rite of Passage". I earned my spot at the top because I kept coming back, even if I lost the week before in the first Match. If this is the game you love, you dont quit cause you cant win, you just try harder, and you DONT accept charity.

 

[blade146]

That keeps getting brought up. Again, I say, you'll still be playing tough competitors. Just for one week, someone will be given a chance at not getting knocked out the first round. You forget these local tourneys are not Swiss Rounds. How is a player going to get experience if every week he's matched up against the guy who won last week? It would be nice if that player could get a little more time at some competitive rounds every once in a while. Otherwise, why show up?

I don't know about this or your tourny but all the local tournaments I go to are swiss. Personally I won't enter a Yugioh tourny unless its swiss. Even a good player can lose and then their day is done. You can't figure your decks problems out in these tournaments. At my local shop we usually go 6 rounds then cut to top 8. If someone wins 3 or 4 weeks in a row we look to take them down instead of not wanting to play them.

 

[krazykidpsx]

actually about that DJ, most of the places i have been and gone, this includes Large scale events all have been swiss round.

of course i havent entered a round robbin [they take for ever] but i have entered swiss countless times.

7 round swiss are long, imagine going 10.

Usually most players that didnt do to good during large events can drop and enter a side event.

but were do you play DJ? cause that is hater to just be Elimination. I can totally feel you there cuase man that is hater. but still over all, Trust me you may think 1 week doesnt drop your game, unless you still play outside of the tournaments sure it doesnt hurt your game but if you just completly stop it does.

It may not be alot but you still get hurt by small tricks.

Ive seen players on MTGO were they play hours and still make mistakes, if they only jumped on it once a week we would basically just spread out the games into weeks and there would be little to no improvement, but if you keep playing its like sticking a bunch of weeks into 1 week.

so yea it does hurt your game a bit not alot but it still does.

why? becuase the week you didnt play was probably the week somebody hit different deck type that you dont know how to beat yet. so when week 3 comes for you to play you will end up losing or just verly wining cause this deck cuased way more trouble than it should have.

but about the non Swiss, that is just hater and that is on your TO. You should ask what the deal is about that.

 

[Digital Jedi]

I personally have never been to a local tourney where they weren't single elimination. I have been under the impression that is the norm. I could be wrong.

Competitive play is all well and good, in it's place and in degrees. I learned to play this game from a guy who, quite frankly, cheated me all the time because he could. I learned to play from him. I didn't learn to play well from him.

What we want out of a tournament environment in a local shop is a less competitive place then, say, a Regional Event. This should be the place where lesser skilled players can feel that they can sharpen their skills. Not consistently be defeated week after week for a $5.00 fee. That 5 bucks is not easy to come by for every player. This is not the Super Bowl. This is not a National Championship or even a Regional. This is a weekly event at a Comic Book store or Card Shop. Here, everyone should have a fair shot at winning and gaining experience, with just a hint more seriousness then casual play. But certainly, we should never treat this as if it's the brass ring.

I go to the shop with my 5 year old son. I give him 5 bucks to enter the local tourney every week. After a few weeks, I begin to see that the same people are crushing him every event. Do I feel like he needs to learn defeat for the cost of 5 dollars a week. No. I can beat him myself for free. This is not the place for such life lessons. This should be the place for even a small fry to sharpen his game. This isn't the Super Bowl. This is a couple of Super Bowl champions coming to the High School every week and flattening the football team because they can. Their not there to teach. They are there to dominate and take the prize for any competitions they can. How is that teaching anybody to be a better player?

 

[masterwoo0]

Because, when you win, you beat someone that mattered. Not something that was set up to give better odds at winning week to week. They call that T-Ball. Everyone gets to hit the ball of the tee, run the bases, and then go home with everyone a winner because they dont keep score.

Teaching someone how to win is much better than teaching someone, "If you cant win, lets eliminate the person who did!"

 

[krazykidpsx]

I personally have never been to a local tourney where they weren't single elimination. I have been under the impression that is the norm. I could be wrong.

Competitive play is all well and good, in it's place and in degrees. I learned to play this game from a guy who, quite frankly, cheated me all the time because he could. I learned to play from him. I didn't learn to play well from him.

What we want out of a tournament environment in a local shop is a less competitive place then, say, a Regional Event. This should be the place where lesser skilled players can feel that they can sharpen their skills. Not consistently be defeated week after week for a $5.00 fee. That 5 bucks is not easy to come by for every player. This is not the Super Bowl. This is not a National Championship or even a Regional. This is a weekly event at a Comic Book store or Card Shop. Here, everyone should have a fair shot at winning and gaining experience, with just a hint more seriousness then casual play. But certainly, we should never treat this as if it's the brass ring.

I go to the shop with my 5 year old son. I give him 5 bucks to enter the local tourney every week. After a few weeks, I begin to see that the same people are crushing him every event. Do I feel like he needs to learn defeat for the cost of 5 dollars a week. No. I can beat him myself for free. This is not the place for such life lessons. This should be the place for even a small fry to sharpen his game. This isn't the Super Bowl. This is a couple of Super Bowl champions coming to the High School every week and flattening the football team because they can. Their not there to teach. They are there to dominate and take the prize for any competitions they can. How is that teaching anybody to be a better player?

okay, yea your area has some issue bro cause Single Elimination is only the norm in drafts, but thats only in 8 man pods. were single Elimination is alright, once you get higher numbers you dont go Single Elimination.

that is just very odd and i personally think your getting cheated. Now if you said that about swiss id be like, buddy you should be playing more than enough games to not bother about it. but oviously its not the case in your area.

Out the entire thing, Yea i see what you mean, becuase personally if its single elimination Constructed id just walk right on out. Not becuase im uncertain about my game but becuase the tournament will not last long. itll go quick and only in 2-3 hours. especially if the players are quick about their games.

but yea if you enter a kid and they keep getting whipped on round 1 i would be like, kid your not comming back for a while im gonna show ya how to play or something, cause losing for 5 is not kool. now if you go 5 rounds straight loss for 5 thats a dollar a loss. lol

if you think the 5 dollars is something try paying 20 and going only 7 rounds.

or 15 and go single elimnation draft.

or 25 for Sealed Deck swiss 7 rounds.

its up there bro, so oviously this has to do with area vs. area.

Most of the areas are swiss and yours is elimnation so i think its just not kool in your area, if you played in most of ours you would be like burnt. Sometimes i came out of events toasted. especially during Pre-Release events, Ive been to 2 and everytime I enter the sealed tournaments i get whoooped, im horrible at sealed, by horrible luck or something cause i most of the time end up with the weaker supported color or with a 5 color deck, its just not good. but during drafts man... that like a different ball game.

we should net draft sometime. lol can djp or somebody make a online App for that? lol that would rock

 

[Digital Jedi]

Because, when you win, you beat someone that mattered. Not something that was set up to give better odds at winning week to week. They call that T-Ball. Everyone gets to hit the ball of the tee, run the bases, and then go home with everyone a winner because they dont keep score.

Teaching someone how to win is much better than teaching someone, "If you cant win, lets eliminate the person who did!"

What elimination? Everytime someone refers to this they attach a finality to it, as if the guys are shot and thrown off a cliff. If Goku had met Freeza when he was just beginning his training, do you think he would have gone Super Saiyan after a few rounds, or do you think Freeza would have squashed him like a bug without ever changing form? You have to evolve your game with relative players. Not directly take on the beast before you've ever garnered the experience you need to beat him. That's the reason you have things like High School, College and Pro Sports. You don't throw Junior into the ring with Mike Tyson in the hopes he'll "get better". All you've done is thrown Mike a snack.

 

[Tiso]

Wasting $5 a week and never getting any better is not going to help those people who cannot win. It is like a RPG. You are facing a LV99 Final Boss and you are only at LV 17. You have no chance to win no matter how many times you try to face the person as you are. How can you get better? You face people on your level and slightly above your level. You progress in a reasonable fashion. Having someone push your potential down is not going to help motivate you to win when you cannot beat the person. All of that is good in theory, but if you cannot even beat the person, how will you ever?

That is why people train themselves and research their own duel styles and theories. There are the majority that say "F*** it. I am going CC to beat this punk because I am TIRED of losing all the time." It may not be fair, but I really do not care. You are holding back the potential of other players when you keep having the same "Gods" beat them down week after week. Keep them from playing that week in the competitve scene. It is not like we saying "No do not come to the store period this weekend." Give the other players a decent and honest shot at becoming better.

 

[krazykidpsx]

not everybody runs CC and not everybody that run's CC constatly win either.

CC is not the answer, skills and determination is the answer.

 

[magnumcyclonex]

Let's be realistic. In some stores, the format is single elimination, and in others, the format is swiss. 2 stores in the same general locality could run their tournaments in the 2 different formats mentioned. That is entirely up to the stores (and sometimes the regular players') discretion.

Now, whether it is swiss or single elimination, if there are a handful of players who consistently place high in the tournament, why should the store ask those players to leave? These players pay money to enter and when they win, they receive prizes. The store relies on its tournaments to attract regular and additional patrons. If the prize structure is attractive, those good players will want to keep coming back for more.

What about the weaker players? What's in it for them? A first round loss in a single elimination tournament often bites much harder than multiple losses in a swiss format. No one wants to pay the entry fee only to be ousted in less than 10 minutes in single elimination format. At least in the swiss format, you can play any number of rounds available, making the entry fee more worthwhile, regardless of the results.

However, weaker players should not have to be given a free ride to the finals if the store bans stronger players for one week. Doing so is an absurd way of doing business. If the tournament was a weekly event and I win this Saturday, I have to wait 2 weeks-not 1 week-in order to be able to come back and play. Giving weaker players a chance to win by barring the stronger players will not promote healthy competition. It is actually discriminatory. The store hurts itself and its player base if it engages in discriminatory actions.

The fact is, this is a tournament. Players pay an entry fee to compete for prizes, whether they are cash, store credit or related product such as boosters or boxes. Whoever places high enough will reap the rewards of their hard work, skill and faith in lady luck for that tournament. This is the reality. You pay to play. There are prizes at stake and there will always be people who are aiming to earn those prizes.

The weaker players will not receive the better prizes. They will be knocked out of contention early on. Yes, it is disappointing week after week for some of them, but you have to ask them what is their reason for playing. For fun? For the prizes?

If you are going to the store to improve your gameplay. Playing better opponents will help. Yes, the difference between a novice and an "expert" is very big. That is reality. Not everyone is the same and some people are better at certain things than others are. However, this difference should not hinder your love of the game. If you truly want to improve, you can ask them to play and teach you before the tournament, in between the rounds, or after the tournament is over.

No one is forcing you to pay the entry fee.

 

[Digital Jedi]

Let's be realistic. In some stores, the format is single elimination, and in others, the format is swiss. 2 stores in the same general locality could run their tournaments in the 2 different formats mentioned. That is entirely up to the stores (and sometimes the regular players') discretion.

Now, whether it is swiss or single elimination, if there are a handful of players who consistently place high in the tournament, why should the store ask those players to leave? These players pay money to enter and when they win, they receive prizes. The store relies on its tournaments to attract regular and additional patrons. If the prize structure is attractive, those good players will want to keep coming back for more.

Let me re-reiterate. I never suggested that the players be asked to leave. I never suggested that they be asked to never play again. I suggested, that ANY player who wins this week has to wait one week before he can enter the exact same tournament again. If there are multiple formats being offered at the store, then there shouldn't be any reason that this person(s) couldn't play in one of those or in casual play. It seems like a good number of people are equating what I suggested as a permanent ban from the store. I never suggested that. I suggested a minor restriction.

What about the weaker players? What's in it for them? A first round loss in a single elimination tournament often bites much harder than multiple losses in a swiss format. No one wants to pay the entry fee only to be ousted in less than 10 minutes in single elimination format. At least in the swiss format, you can play any number of rounds available, making the entry fee more worthwhile, regardless of the results.

However, weaker players should not have to be given a free ride to the finals if the store bans stronger players for one week. Doing so is an absurd way of doing business. If the tournament was a weekly event and I win this Saturday, I have to wait 2 weeks-not 1 week-in order to be able to come back and play. Giving weaker players a chance to win by barring the stronger players will not promote healthy competition. It is actually discriminatory. The store hurts itself and its player base if it engages in discriminatory actions.

In absolutely, positively no way is my suggestion a "free ride". This is like one or two guys who don't get to compete in one particular tournament this week. Your still playing everybody else who didn't win last week. Let's not presume that because these two guys are good that everybody else is on the exact same skill level with each other. All this does is increase odds and spread the experience out a bit.

Again, I never suggested a permanent or one week ban from the store and any and all events. Just in this one tournament. If you have more then one event at your store as some suggest, there's no reason they couldn't compete in one of those. This just "limits", and I emphasize "limits", the number of events that a couple of overly qualified people dominate weaker less experienced players in. It doesn't eliminate it all together.

The fact is, this is a tournament. Players pay an entry fee to compete for prizes, whether they are cash, store credit or related product such as boosters or boxes. Whoever places high enough will reap the rewards of their hard work, skill and faith in lady luck for that tournament. This is the reality. You pay to play. There are prizes at stake and there will always be people who are aiming to earn those prizes.

And I'll again reemphasize the fact that this is a store tournament, not a Regional event, and should not be treated as such. The situation presented in the first post is an unfair system, and should not be perpetuated because a handful of players want to treat every single paid event as if their entry into Worlds hinges on it. I am against the notion that because you can take advantage of weaker, less experienced people that you should take advantage of them at every available opportunity. That's beyond unfair. That's abuse.

The weaker players will not receive the better prizes. They will be knocked out of contention early on. Yes, it is disappointing week after week for some of them, but you have to ask them what is their reason for playing. For fun? For the prizes?
If you are going to the store to improve your gameplay. Playing better opponents will help. Yes, the difference between a novice and an "expert" is very big. That is reality. Not everyone is the same and some people are better at certain things than others are. However, this difference should not hinder your love of the game. If you truly want to improve, you can ask them to play and teach you before the tournament, in between the rounds, or after the tournament is over.

As I pointed out in my previous posts, you cannot improve your game by consistently facing a dragon with an eggbeater. There has to be balance. You start with something around your level and work your way up. In the situation presented, there is no balance. The players have found an easy meal ticket and are taking advantage of it. It would be different if they were only doing so once in a while, but from what's posted, it looks like they are doing so to the point of making no one want to even show up. This is not the spirit of competition. This is just like the Pro Athlete I mentioned earlier beating up on High School athletes, just because they can.

No one is forcing you to pay the entry fee.

That is not an excuse for abuse. Pardon me for this rather strong analogy, I don't mean it to be mean spirited, but you might as well tell the people of New Orleans that no one told them to live in on a flood prone coast. You can't fault inexperienced players for entering a local tournament any more then you can fault them for being inexperienced. The idea behind the limitation is so that the players in question still get to play but that everyone else gets a chance, a chance, at winning. There are no free rides involved. I'm suggesting taking the pro's off the field every once in a while and letting the boys play.

My point is, would you want to compete in a batting cage competition if Barry Bonds showed up every week sole intent on winning? Would you want to enter a slam dunk competition each week only to have Micheal Jordan show up every single time and playing at the top of his game? Would you want to continue to enter a monthly penciling contest only to have Jim Lee take home the prize every month? Is anyone forcing you to enter these competition? No. That doesn't make it fair.

 

[masterwoo0]

At most stores, the entry fee pays for either a Tournament Pack, or a regular Booster Pack.

At one of the Stores I used to go to, I was usually one of the Top 3 people who would win week after week. The TO gave out TP's to EVERYONE. The Finalist got a little more, but not anything that was jaw dropping, maybe some Deck Sleeves or a nice Deck Box, and sometimes a couple Boosters if there was a larger turnout.

MANY TIMES when I won, I got a crappy set of TP Commons out of my pack, while someone who didnt even make Top 8 would walk away after they were eliminated with a TP Ultra Rare or Super. IS THAT FAIR?? I do all the hard work and win the whole enchilada, and walk away with just the wrapper, while my lesser opponents get the meal?

Everything balances out in the end, and I didnt actually mind not getting a holo when I won, and this happened several times to me. I remember a kid who would come every week and usually end up leaving in tears because he couldnt win, but when he pulled a Ultra Rare TP5 Luminous Soldier, it made his day and changed his outlook about the game. He didnt mind taking a loss anymore because he knew that he didnt have to "win" to get something good, even if it wasnt going to be every week that it happened.

And DJ, no one is saying that you are calling for a "Ban" of the player, but when you realize that 1 week is not 1 week, but "2", meaning 14 days that the individual cannot play (because, as you said, this "isn't" a Regional, and most stores arent large enough to support more than one type of Tourney, especially of the same event), and that isnt fair if there is nowhere else to play in the meantime. That's a penalty for someone who regularly plays.

Your suggestion ONLY works if there are alternatives that allow the person to still play week to week. Otherwise, it sends a bad message to all players, and could have the exact same affect that winning did.

And one last thing, you arent playing the same person 7 to 8 times in the same event, so if they cant get better playing the OTHER players, then something is wrong no matter how you slice it.

 

[Tiso]

Woo, how is that balanced? And for your info, it is fair. Buying packs and getting what is inside is supposed to be RANDOM. It does not matter if you won the big thing and you got crap in the pack. Them the breaks.

 

[masterwoo0]

Woo, how is that balanced? And for your info, it is fair. Buying packs and getting what is inside is supposed to be RANDOM. It does not matter if you won the big thing and you got crap in the pack. Them the breaks.

I thought I made that clear that I didnt care? That I would win over and over and get nothing.

Where did I say that I never came back because I didnt get good cards? If I'm "telling you" that I keep winning and get nothing, what should you take from that comment?

"Winning doesnt always mean you get good things"

I know what the breaks are. After playing at the same store almost weekly for 2 years, I walked away with only 2 Super Rares from TP's.

 

[english chef]

Winning is, in itself, worth (modest) bragging rights. I remember taking well over a year before winning my first local tourney, and I am still happy that I did so. These days I still don't win them very often, but that doesn't matter to me so much- I just enjoy playing.

My local store gives everyone who pays an entrance fee a booster pack. Sometimes TP, but usually not. Then it is swiss, so that everyone gets a minimum of 3 matches. then it is usually cut to final 4 or final 2, depending on how many people play. The quarter finalists get an extra pack, and the finalists get 2 packs, with the winner getting either a single (stores choice) or an extra pack.
Everyone has an equal chance of pulling something interesting from their packs, but thos who do well get more chances. And ultimately, everyone can buy more packs which is what the store wants in the first place.

What tends to happen is that when the less capable/experienced players get something good, they tend to be told to keep it by the better players, who help them integrate it into their decks. The rare, but not overly useful stuff, or that which requires a specialist deck (TP ultras/supers come to mind) get traded for good stuff that the kids can use in their decks. And in all cases, the experienced players help the less experienced players with their deck designs, card choices, trade them some stuff that is useful to them, whilst explaining and trying to teach them how to be better. And they learn!

Incidently, this is not CC heaven- the vets will help the otherss with whatever it is that they want to do . So if a Horus/batteryman/elemental hero/fusion etc deck is required, then they will help them build that type of deck whilst explaining why and how those cards work, for that type of deck.

It makes for a much more interesting tourney, with a huge variety of different deck types. rather than a less interesting tourney, where everyone aspires to a CC deck.

 

[Digital Jedi]

All I'm suggesting is to balance things out if they are unbalanced to begin with. The presumption we all seem to have made is that every tourney is just like the one we attend regularly. Even I made that assumption. Where I go, you do not get TPs for entering. You do not get packs for entering. The best we've ever gotten was some movie packs with the single common in them. You pay $5.00 for a single elimination match with the grand prize being a box of some overstock. Maybe even less then that. You can even "trade-in" to the event if you don't have the money to do so. As long as you have something worth trading. So as you can see, if your running the event as close to a Regional as possible, with benefits and prizes for all involved (though not all regionals are run that way), then two people dominating every event might not seem like big deal. But not all local events are run that way, and I personally don't see how it can be sort of fair one way, but not the other. Nothings stopping a player from playing casually that day. It looks to me like the only interests they have are selfish in nature. Which is why 14 days of non-tournament play because you played well that week doesn't really make want to shed a tear for them.

 

[John Danker]

Expanding on what English Chef has said...

The trick is to get the players at the store to have a sense of community. It's really not as hard as it sounds. I think about any gamer will admit that their in the minority among their friends. Because of this gamers tend to have a feeling that when they're with gamers their among their peers. Everyone wants to feel "important" Take advantage of that an encorage those experienced players to share their knowledge (it doesn't hurt to butter them up a bit with praise)

The biggest steps to making a community in your store are likely to be done by YOU. Someone has to set the example, someone has to be a community leader. By sharing what you know, helping others, sharing extra cards, taking the time to help people with their decks, etc.....you set the pace and others will notice. After all, who would YOU rather hang around with? Someone who is helpful and sharing or someone who comes to a tournament, wins it, then dashes out the door?

After about 6 months or so you'll find the attitude has spread and people who don't wish to share that same community feeling are looked at with a tilt of the head while people wonder if they woke up on the wrong side of the bed.

Selfishness is contagious....and so is giving and sharing. Which of the two mindsets are adopted where you play could very well greatly depend on YOU and YOU developing the positive mindset among your friends.

 

[DaGuyWitBluGlasses]

My point is, would you want to compete in a batting cage competition if Barry Bonds showed up every week sole intent on winning? Would you want to enter a slam dunk competition each week only to have Micheal Jordan show up every single time and playing at the top of his game? Would you want to continue to enter a monthly penciling contest only to have Jim Lee take home the prize every month? Is anyone forcing you to enter these competition? No. That doesn't make it fair.

Yes, yes, and yes. I most certainly would like to compete in that environment.