Card Trooper vs Banisher of Radiance

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Teufelhunden

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If Banisher of Radiance is on the field, can I still use Card Trooper's effect to send cards to the grave to pump it up, even though those cards go out of play?
 
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Officially: It's still being debated so there isn't an "official" answer. Some people say it's the cost (so no), same say it's part of the effect (so yes) and then there's Destruction of Destiny which has a similar effect (about sending cards to the GY) BUT you still take damage even if Banisher of the Radiance is on the field and the cards never make the Graveyard and the card text says "send to the Graveyard". So, before anyone starts debating things up, just keep this in mind:

There is no official answer and anyone's opinion on the subject for now is just that. Opinion and best guesses only for now.
 
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On the Japanese Rulings, 'Card Trooper' has been updated, and there says that sending the cards to the graveyard is a cost, for whoever cares to know (I know, I was one of the defenders that it was part of the effect).
 
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Cropz said:
On the Japanese Rulings, 'Card Trooper' has been updated, and there says that sending the cards to the graveyard is a cost, for whoever cares to know (I know, I was one of the defenders that it was part of the effect).
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That's definately interesting if it is indeed a cost. Sending 3 cards from the top of you deck to the Graveyard being a cost for Card Trooper just makes it incredibly more powerful. It's already a Dekoichi on steroids.
 
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but if it's a cost it opens up another question with Dimensional Fissure....can it be activated if DF is face up on the field....since you don't know if monsters/ Spell / or Trap cards will be sent? This was another item debated among some of the judges recently.
 
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Maruno said:
If it's a cost, you can pay it regardless of what's on the field.
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That's not true. Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning has a Cost Requirement to summon him, and Kycoo the Ghost Destroyer prevents the cost from being paid, as cards cannot be removed from the Graveyard by the opponent.

So, if you cannot send cards to the Graveyard as the Cost for Card Trooper because of Macro Cosmos, then it DOES matter what is on the field. Additionally, because the cards for his effect must be sent as a group rather than "one at a time", you cannot send cards that you do not know what they will be when picked up.
 
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Thanks for all of the input on this one guys. I just looked up Bazoo the soul-eater's rullings and find that it's effect is a cost, so I would say that Card Trooper's is a cost as well. In that case, you wold not be able to pay the cost as you would not be able to send cards to the graveyard. All in agreement say "I".
 
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John Danker said:
If it's a cost then you can be assured, Card Trooper's effect would not be able to be activated....IF...it's a cost.
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"to" is ambiguous, actually.

When Thunder Dragon for example said "discard to the graveyard" it was not incorrect, even though it would still work when discarded and removed from play. Now thunder dragon could get away with being changed to jsut "discard" because discard indicates its going to the graveyard.

HOwever
"Once per turn, you can send up to 3 cards from the top of your Deck" doesn't give any indication of where they are supposed to go. So it is necessary to put "to the graveyard" even if the cards are not required to end up in the graveyard.

"to the graveyard" mean either:
"deliver these cards to the graveyard" or "(send/discard these cards) in the directon of the graveyard"
 
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SEND to the graveyard....with these words, so long as it's sent (not discarded or tributed) and as long as it's a cost of activation, the effect cannot be activated when Bannisher is face up on the field. This holds true with all like card effects in the game of Yugioh.

Card Trooper

Text
Once per turn, you can send up to 3 cards from the top of your Deck to the Graveyard. This card gains 500 ATK for each card sent to the Graveyard this way, until the end of this turn. When this card on your side of the field is destroyed and sent to your Graveyard, draw 1 card.

Nothing ambiguous about the bolded text that I see.
 
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But that's not good grammar. I know, this is Yu-Gi-Oh!, but still, the phrase needs the "to wherever" bit (I don't know what you call that; I don't do English). "Send" on its own means nothing, because you always send something somewhere.

"Remove from play" has the "to wherever" part, and "discard" directly implies the Graveyard, because that's where everything (usually) ends up. "Send" on its own sounds bad.

If we could use "discard" for cards in the Deck as well as in the hand, then good. That would work. But we have no precedent.
 
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DaGuyWitBluGlasses said:
Then how would you word it if it didn't matter where it went?
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The statement is pointless, all cards in the game that send to the graveyard as a cost work in the way I described.

It's like asking, why don't we say "I fall up?" We don't think about it because the definition of a fall is downward under the force of gravity. In the same manner gravity=game mechanic. As long as the game mechanic is present cards sent from the top of the deck and designated as to the graveyard as a cost will not work if they do not go to the graveyard.

If they want something to work even if it doesn't get sent to the graveyard, they'll have to figure out a wording on their own, that's not my job to do for them, as a judge it's my job to help people play the game correctly, not figure out how they're going to work around a game mechanic.
 
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I never said it should be interpreted the other way.

However "send to the graveyard" should mean "send to the graveyard" so jsut because its a cost or not does not necessarily make a difference.

We have some cards that can't resolve their effects when the card can't make it to the graveyard, and some that can't, even though they both say "send to the graveyard"

Since some effects are also interpreted as not being able to go elsewhere, it thus disproves the theory that its because its a cost that makes the difference.

Thus, there is no proof that it's a game mechanic.

And so it remains ambiguous, and the only reason it should be ruled that you can't pay it, is because the burden of proof lies on someone to say that you can.
 
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DaGuyWitBluGlasses said:
We have some cards that can't resolve their effects when the card can't make it to the graveyard, and some that can't, even though they both say "send to the graveyard"
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Agreed

DaGuyWitBluGlasses said:
Since some effects are also interpreted as not being able to go elsewhere, it thus disproves the theory that its because its a cost that makes the difference.
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The proof of the theory is that there is not one card which can activate if part of that activation is paying a cost that specifies that it be "sent to the graveyard" That is simply all I stated from the beginning. When you find a card effect in this game that goes against this by all means please bring it to our attention, until that time I don't believe there can be any greater proff to the theory.
 
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I'm not sure what you're looking for, but what about Polymerization?

"¢ You can activate "Polymerization" while "Macro Cosmos" is active on the field because sending Fusion Material Monsters to the Graveyard is an effect of "Polymerization" and not a cost.

EDIT: Oh, "cost"! Never mind....
Maruno said:
But that's not good grammar. I know, this is Yu-Gi-Oh!, but still, the phrase needs the "to wherever" bit (I don't know what you call that; I don't do English). "Send" on its own means nothing, because you always send something somewhere.
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No, it's perfectly fine to use "to send" without specifying where to send it.

For example, is the sentence "I sent the present." improper?
 
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